Following on from the tangential nature of the Covid, Trump and several other threads, here is a place for all of the wild and also not wild theories doing the rounds both presently and historically.
I'll start with a couple of obvious and big ones, which I have mentioned while derailing other threads..
WTC Building 7 was collapsed on purpose. I don't know the reason but it is plain to see it was done on purpose.
The planes are spraying something. I haven't a clue why but I'm pretty sure it isn't to poison us all. Something else along the lines of geoengineering or weather control most likely but no proof other than looking at it that it is indeed happening at all.
Anyone care to discuss/refute?
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I knew you'd be first!
Be interesting to hear of what ones beyond the obvious that any of us might know as well, I just picked 2 that everyone will have seen or heard of
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Even if there was a secret cabal and they knew above everyone else what was really going on behind the veil of existence, they still wouldn't know any more about the meaning of life or of what happens beyond death than anyone else here. It's grand not to know as well
Quote from: astfgyl on July 05, 2020, 10:21:41 PMThe planes are spraying something. I haven't a clue why but I'm pretty sure it isn't to poison us all. Something else along the lines of geoengineering or weather control most likely but no proof other than looking at it that it is indeed happening at all.
Anyone care to discuss/refute?
This on in particular hurts my head. Contrails... Condensation trails. It's junior cert physics. You can see the same thing being caused by the tails of F1 cars (because they're effectively upside down wings that are used to generate downforce instead of lift).
Weather control does happen. Planes go up in arid regions (or areas that may have crops damages due to lack of rainfall) and release a compound called silver iodide that acts as condensation nuclei to catalyse cloud formation. This isn't a conspiracy, it's happening since the 1940s or so.
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Quote from: astfgyl on July 05, 2020, 10:21:41 PM
The planes are spraying something.
Yes, it's called exhaust fumes and happens as a result of combustion engines. Temperatures at the altitudes the planes operate at are low enough for this to condense.
The adrenochrome stuff is an unsettling rabbit hole, bizarre and terrifying if there's a shred of truth to it. I've not dug deep enough though, so it could have been proven some sort of piss take.
With the arrest of Ghislane Maxwell I went back watching some of the stuff about Pizza Gate, Isaac Kappy, Podesta, World Corp and all that.
It seems well accepted that Epstein was procuring young girls, and there's so much to it it seems like it can't all be a 'conspiracy'.
I used to work with a legend of a lad who was great for conspiracy theories. One was about Bear Gryls guiding the pope and some famous people to an underground city in the Antarctic which has been covered up. He had a big thing about how no-one has gone back the moon in so long because Aliens control it and have barred us from going back. He also claimed to have special blood that meant he couldn't be cloned. No explanation as to who or what wanted to clone him. Cattle mutilation is a result of aliens wearing human suits but since they cant do the lips right they take the lips off of cow mutilations. What else... Theres two types of UFOs, the orange triangular ones are the bad ones apparently. cant remember what the other type was but they were sound according to him. I moved to a different section in work about a year ago so I haven't heard any others from him.
Realistically though I think that 99.99% of these things are absolute bullshit made up by people who have even less of a clue about whats going on than the average person. But hey what the fuck do I know.
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I thought everyone knew that the pointy UFOs were the bad ones.... :laugh:
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After reading into operation northwoods I give more leeway to the false flag narrative.
Quote from: mugz on July 06, 2020, 03:26:47 AM
the chemtrails thing is a diversionary thing. It may well be true but compared to other stuff with air travel I could mention, it's not a big deal.
It's not true. In any way, shape or form.
Quote from: mugz on July 06, 2020, 12:50:39 PM
Quote from: Wiseblood on July 06, 2020, 12:39:39 PM
I thought everyone knew that the pointy UFOs were the bad ones.... :laugh:
black shepherd will be able to chime in with details about how our minds create ethics out of shape, so if you did a survey you'd get 75% of respondents saying 'pointy' aliens are more likely to be malign or dangerous than 'squishy' aliens, even though on a surface level it looks like a nonsense question.
Via the bouba/kiki effect? Without taking away from his therapeutic work with phantom limb ( :abbath: ) patients, I find it very difficult to get on board with Ramachandran's logical leaps, whether that be about visual-audio-moral synaesthesia or mirror neurons. Despite his relatively squishy appearance, I see him as a "bad" scientist, because he is too dogmatically fixated on selling the truth value of his theories...which is, fittingly, also pretty much my problem with the majority of "conspiracy theory".
Quote from: Francis Bacon (the 17th century one)The human understanding when it has once adopted an opinion (either as being the received opinion or as being agreeable to itself) draws all things else to support and agree with it. And though there be a greater number and weight of instances to be found on the other side, yet these it either neglects and despises, or else by some distinction sets aside and rejects; in order that by this great and pernicious predetermination the authority of its former conclusions may remain inviolate. [...] And such is the way of all superstitions, whether in astrology, dreams, omens, divine judgments, or the like; wherein men, having a delight in such vanities, mark the events where they are fulfilled, but where they fail, although this happened much oftener, neglect and pass them by.
Quote from: Ducky on July 06, 2020, 03:15:33 AM
Quote from: astfgyl on July 05, 2020, 10:21:41 PMThe planes are spraying something. I haven't a clue why but I'm pretty sure it isn't to poison us all. Something else along the lines of geoengineering or weather control most likely but no proof other than looking at it that it is indeed happening at all.
Anyone care to discuss/refute?
This on in particular hurts my head. Contrails... Condensation trails. It's junior cert physics. You can see the same thing being caused by the tails of F1 cars (because they're effectively upside down wings that are used to generate downforce instead of lift).
Weather control does happen. Planes go up in arid regions (or areas that may have crops damages due to lack of rainfall) and release a compound called silver iodide that acts as condensation nuclei to catalyse cloud formation. This isn't a conspiracy, it's happening since the 1940s or so.
I know about contrails. And I know about cloud seeding. And yes it was explained to me back in school, but this is not the same thing, this is known as persistent contrails, which according to NASA is a relatively new occurrence. So even if you don't think it is anything it is still caused by something outside the normal run of things. My guess is that you haven't spent much time looking up at it to notice anything off about it. I have spent a lot of time watching it myself and I am convinced it is not normal. Regular contrails do not spread out like that, they disappear behind the plane. What hurts my head is folks who will believe what they read but not what they can see with their own two eyes.
Quote from: astfgyl on July 06, 2020, 03:31:55 PM
...persistent contrails, which according to NASA is a relatively new occurrence...
NASA source, please.
Quote from: Yung Led Zeppelin on July 06, 2020, 10:04:47 AM
Quote from: astfgyl on July 05, 2020, 10:21:41 PM
The planes are spraying something.
Yes, it's called exhaust fumes and happens as a result of combustion engines. Temperatures at the altitudes the planes operate at are low enough for this to condense.
As a kid, I used to lay on my back looking up at the sky watching the planes go by. The contrails back then (late 80s, early 90s) used to do the normal thing and disappear behind the lanes, not spread out over the whole sky as they do now. Do your own bit of research, go find some of your or your parents old photos where there is sky in them, and see if even one of them has the persistent type of trail which is common these days. It has changed significantly in the last 20 years or so. This may be due to changes in atmospheric pressure or temperatures, or it might be some changes to the type of fuel used which could in turn affect how the vapour condenses. Maybe? I found it equally amazing during lock down, where air traffic was operating at about one tenth of its' usual amount, that the amount of trails in the sky remained unchanged. But as I said to the other fella, don't mind what you can see with your own two eyes, just google the answer to try refute what you think I'm saying...
Quote from: Juggz on July 06, 2020, 03:40:30 PM
Quote from: astfgyl on July 06, 2020, 03:31:55 PM
...persistent contrails, which according to NASA is a relatively new occurrence...
NASA source, please.
There is a bit here, but it isn't the one I was talking about. The one I was reading was asking people to report incidences of it to NASA to help with their research into this relatively new phenomenon. I will dig it out but it will take a few minutes https://science-edu.larc.nasa.gov/contrail-edu/science.html
Quote from: astfgyl on July 06, 2020, 03:41:08 PM
As a kid, I used to lay on my back looking up at the sky watching the planes go by. The contrails back then (late 80s, early 90s) used to do the normal thing and disappear behind the lanes, not spread out over the whole sky as they do now. Do your own bit of research, go find some of your or your parents old photos where there is sky in them, and see if even one of them has the persistent type of trail which is common these days. It has changed significantly in the last 20 years or so. This may be due to changes in atmospheric pressure or temperatures, or it might be some changes to the type of fuel used which could in turn affect how the vapour condenses. Maybe? I found it equally amazing during lock down, where air traffic was operating at about one tenth of its' usual amount, that the amount of trails in the sky remained unchanged. But as I said to the other fella, don't mind what you can see with your own two eyes, just google the answer to try refute what you think I'm saying...
Here are some B-17s over Germany in the 1940s.
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/78/II_World_War_contrails.jpg/964px-II_World_War_contrails.jpg)
On the subject of these theories in general, I reckon that almost all are shite. Even ones I think I like the sound of can usually be explained away fairly handy. I find the WTC ones the most fascinating, specifically the magical falling building. And as mentioned, because of things like Operation Northwoods, a lot of stuff around that seems believable, given what happened after.
Like for me there is a massive leap from looking at that incident and smelling a rat of sorts, and then somehow tying that into alien abductions, area 51, nazis in the antarctic, flat earth, man didn't land on the moon etc. Attaching the term conspiracy theory to all of the theories immediately prevents 99 percent of people from giving any credence to what is being said, i.e. "I think the US government has done some false flag shit over the years" can be immediately written off with "ah that's only a conspiracy theory like all the fuckin ancient aliens shit". There you go, mind closed. And also there are those who go the other way, that they think just because governments have lied and covered up some things, that must mean that everything proposed, such as the flat earth, is true and it gets all David Icke with the lizard people and whatnot.
It is a subject which usually lacks balance in the discussion, but I've always loved unsolved mysteries and the like and I think that is why these theories fascinate me, that there may be a grain of truth in them somewhere along the line, if one sifts through enough of the shite
Quote from: astfgyl on July 06, 2020, 03:41:08 PM
Quote from: Yung Led Zeppelin on July 06, 2020, 10:04:47 AM
Quote from: astfgyl on July 05, 2020, 10:21:41 PM
The planes are spraying something.
Yes, it's called exhaust fumes and happens as a result of combustion engines. Temperatures at the altitudes the planes operate at are low enough for this to condense.
As a kid, I used to lay on my back looking up at the sky watching the planes go by. The contrails back then (late 80s, early 90s) used to do the normal thing and disappear behind the lanes, not spread out over the whole sky as they do now. Do your own bit of research, go find some of your or your parents old photos where there is sky in them, and see if even one of them has the persistent type of trail which is common these days. It has changed significantly in the last 20 years or so. This may be due to changes in atmospheric pressure or temperatures, or it might be some changes to the type of fuel used which could in turn affect how the vapour condenses. Maybe? I found it equally amazing during lock down, where air traffic was operating at about one tenth of its' usual amount, that the amount of trails in the sky remained unchanged. But as I said to the other fella, don't mind what you can see with your own two eyes, just google the answer to try refute what you think I'm saying...
Quote from: astfgyl on July 06, 2020, 03:41:08 PM
The planes are spraying something. I haven't a clue why but I'm pretty sure it isn't to poison us all. Something else along the lines of geoengineering or weather control most likely but no proof other than looking at it that it is indeed happening at all.
?
Quote from: Juggz on July 06, 2020, 04:13:12 PM
Here are some B-17s over Germany in the 1940s.
I've seen that picture before, and also have seen other ones taken over France during WWII. I would say that was a rather different situation with the concentration of so many of those planes over a relatively small area, and is not analogous to what we see every day in the normal run of things.
Also, you picked on my saying to a fella to look with his own eyes, at his own or his parents' pictures of normal times and with the sky in the background, and then post up a picture specifically of a squadron of planes from 1940 during a World War.. I wonder have you any old pics of your own at home with trails like that in them? I doubt it, unless you were at an air show.
And who knows, maybe the proliferation of these persistent trails in the last 2 decades or so is an indication of something else changed with the atmosphere itself in that time frame and the planes themselves are doing as they always did, but it still isn't normal or else it would have been happening all along and it wouldn't be so noticeable now.
Can we just call this thread 'The Tin Foil Hat Brigade' and be done with it?
Quote from: Yung Led Zeppelin on July 06, 2020, 04:19:29 PM
?
Indeed. Reading back on it there, I should have worded it differently in my OP. What I should have said is that I think it looks like, rather than saying I'm convinced that something is being sprayed, because I'm always open to learning more.
Here is a brief mention of geoengineering using particles sprayed into the upper atmosphere, which is what I think it looks like: https://www.irishexaminer.com/viewpoints/analysis/climate-engineering-is-a-risky-gamble-to-fix-planets-problems-461047.html. There are also other types of geoengineering proposed as well, and there is a lot of (non conspiracy theory) information out there on it. Try reading a little of it before writing off the idea entirely, if you have a spare few minutes sometime.
Do honestly look at some old pictures as well though (not ones of WWII, some of your own or old family ones) and see if these types of persistent trails are to be seen in any of them? Old movies are another source you could look at I suppose as well, or TV shows pre 2000 or so and the trails aren't there. So what has changed? Have we reached some sort of saturation point in the upper atmosphere then, if one wishes to exclude the possibility of geoengineering?
More stuff on it here https://www.pnas.org/content/116/4/1089 and here https://e360.yale.edu/features/geoengineer-the-planet-more-scientists-now-say-it-must-be-an-option. there is loads of it out there anyway. This is the sort of thing I think it looks has been going on with the planes for the last 20 years or so
Quote from: astfgyl on July 06, 2020, 04:23:57 PM
Quote from: Juggz on July 06, 2020, 04:13:12 PM
Here are some B-17s over Germany in the 1940s.
I've seen that picture before, and also have seen other ones taken over France during WWII. I would say that was a rather different situation with the concentration of so many of those planes over a relatively small area, and is not analogous to what we see every day in the normal run of things.
Also, you picked on my saying to a fella to look with his own eyes, at his own or his parents' pictures of normal times and with the sky in the background, and then post up a picture specifically of a squadron of planes from 1940 during a World War.. I wonder have you any old pics of your own at home with trails like that in them? I doubt it, unless you were at an air show.
And who knows, maybe the proliferation of these persistent trails in the last 2 decades or so is an indication of something else changed with the atmosphere itself in that time frame and the planes themselves are doing as they always did, but it still isn't normal or else it would have been happening all along and it wouldn't be so noticeable now.
I picked a famous, old photo because it's famous and old and shows what you're talking about is not a new phenomenon, no matter how one tries to wriggle out of it. You don't need to rely on photos, there are enough films of it happening which show it too, so, you could say it pre-dates chemtrailmania by several decades. Unless, of course, they were also spraying the Germans with chillout juice? :abbath:
Quote from: Carnage on July 06, 2020, 04:32:08 PM
Can we just call this thread 'The Tin Foil Hat Brigade' and be done with it?
[
/quote]Quote from: astfgyl on July 06, 2020, 04:14:28 PM
On the subject of these theories in general, I reckon that almost all are shite. Even ones I think I like the sound of can usually be explained away fairly handy. I find the WTC ones the most fascinating, specifically the magical falling building. And as mentioned, because of things like Operation Northwoods, a lot of stuff around that seems believable, given what happened after.
Like for me there is a massive leap from looking at that incident and smelling a rat of sorts, and then somehow tying that into alien abductions, area 51, nazis in the antarctic, flat earth, man didn't land on the moon etc. Attaching the term conspiracy theory to all of the theories immediately prevents 99 percent of people from giving any credence to what is being said, i.e. "I think the US government has done some false flag shit over the years" can be immediately written off with "ah that's only a conspiracy theory like all the fuckin ancient aliens shit". There you go, mind closed. And also there are those who go the other way, that they think just because governments have lied and covered up some things, that must mean that everything proposed, such as the flat earth, is true and it gets all David Icke with the lizard people and whatnot.
It is a subject which usually lacks balance in the discussion, but I've always loved unsolved mysteries and the like and I think that is why these theories fascinate me, that there may be a grain of truth in them somewhere along the line, if one sifts through enough of the shite
It's a pity that the tin foil hat thing is always used to refute anything that might fall outside of the official narrative, when some of it clearly has something to it. I explained it better in the quoted text
Quote from: Juggz on July 06, 2020, 04:46:45 PM
Quote from: astfgyl on July 06, 2020, 04:23:57 PM
Quote from: Juggz on July 06, 2020, 04:13:12 PM
Here are some B-17s over Germany in the 1940s.
I've seen that picture before, and also have seen other ones taken over France during WWII. I would say that was a rather different situation with the concentration of so many of those planes over a relatively small area, and is not analogous to what we see every day in the normal run of things.
Also, you picked on my saying to a fella to look with his own eyes, at his own or his parents' pictures of normal times and with the sky in the background, and then post up a picture specifically of a squadron of planes from 1940 during a World War.. I wonder have you any old pics of your own at home with trails like that in them? I doubt it, unless you were at an air show.
And who knows, maybe the proliferation of these persistent trails in the last 2 decades or so is an indication of something else changed with the atmosphere itself in that time frame and the planes themselves are doing as they always did, but it still isn't normal or else it would have been happening all along and it wouldn't be so noticeable now.
I picked a famous, old photo because it's famous and old and shows what you're talking about is not a new phenomenon, no matter how one tries to wriggle out of it. You don't need to rely on photos, there are enough films of it happening which show it too, so, you could say it pre-dates chemtrailmania by several decades. Unless, of course, they were also spraying the Germans with chillout juice? :abbath:
I don't think it's the sort of chillout juice thing you mention, although I have heard of that line of thinking, too. Again, that photo is hardly representative of a normal day in 2020. I think the geoengineering thing is much more likely, or as I mentioned above, maybe the upper atmosphere has reached a sort of saturation point and it affects how these things dissipate, which would not be disproven by that photo. In fact the circumstances of that picture would support the idea
Quote from: astfgylI think the geoengineering thing is much more likely
I think the pressurised, hot exhaust gas spewed into very cold air thing is even more likely than that 8)
There was a good documentary called JFK the secret killer or something that put forward the theory (using the Warren report) that the second shot that blew Kennedy's head off was actually a misfire from one of the agents in the car behind who had all been drinking the night before. JFKs brain had been taken away before the autopsy because according to the FBI the family wanted it...hmmm.
The thing that I do like about that theory that does bring a little tear to my eye is, if true, that guy made a really big fuck up but his work colleaguess all worked like bastards and helped to cover it up.
Fucking up at work..uh oh
Mates who got your back... priceless
Quote from: Juggz on July 06, 2020, 05:16:50 PM
Quote from: astfgylI think the geoengineering thing is much more likely
I think the pressurised, hot exhaust gas spewed into very cold air thing is even more likely than that 8)
Well played! :laugh:
Isn't the persistence of contrails mainly a function of altitude? I live near enough an airport (20 minute drive) and essentially all the contrails I see are the kind that disappear within a few minutes; I'm actually looking out my office window at some disappearing right now. They do contribute to the environmental impact of air flight, and I think one of the suggestions that has been offered is actually to have planes fly slightly lower, to find a good balance height between the benefits of high altitude flight and the negative side-effects of that (presuming, as I perhaps disappointingly do, that contrails and their openly discussed negative effects are side-effects and not effects by design).
Quote from: Kunt 4 Life on July 06, 2020, 05:22:12 PM
There was a good documentary called JFK the secret killer or something that put forward the theory (using the Warren report) that the second shot that blew Kennedy's head off was actually a misfire from one of the agents in the car behind who had all been drinking the night before. JFKs brain had been taken away before the autopsy because according to the FBI the family wanted it...hmmm.
The thing that I do like about that theory that does bring a little tear to my eye is, if true, that guy made a really big fuck up but his work colleaguess all worked like bastards and helped to cover it up.
Fucking up at work..uh oh
Mates who got your back... priceless
Can't remember where I saw it, but I was reading something which proposed that George Bush senior was the orchestrator of that assassination. Maybe not reading actually, I think it was the Bright Insight channel on youtube where I came across that one. There are so many theories regarding the how and why of that one, it's hard to keep up with them all.
The Kurt Cobain didn't shoot himself is another one that has been doing the rounds over the years, but I haven't seen anything convincing about it. I suppose that doesn't really count though as it's more of a whodunnit than a cover up thing. I think he did it himself anyway.
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on July 06, 2020, 05:30:23 PM
Isn't the persistence of contrails mainly a function of altitude? I live near enough an airport (20 minute drive) and essentially all the contrails I see are the kind that disappear within a few minutes; I'm actually looking out my office window at some disappearing right now. They do contribute to the environmental impact of air flight, and I think one of the suggestions that has been offered is actually to have planes fly slightly lower, to find a good balance height between the benefits of high altitude flight and the negative side-effects of that (presuming, as I perhaps disappointingly do, that contrails and their openly discussed negative effects are side-effects and not effects by design).
From the NASA stuff I was reading there, it seems altitude is the deciding factor in them forming at all, but I don't know if it comes into how persistent they are or are not.
How I arrived at my suspicion of the trails was a few years ago, having noticed them become more frequent and more persistent, I came across an article in National Geographic or New Scientist about geoengineering, and the way it was described in the article as a proposed solution to climate change was extremely fitting for what I was looking at anyway. Then I looked it up a bit on the internet and of course the theories were wild and self defeating in their ridiculousness and the term chemtrails had been coined and the tinfoil hat label attached by then, so I feel that the whole thing was sort of ridiculed and forgotten about and accepted as if it has always been so commonplace as a result of the sort of person who latched onto the idea.
So that's my view on it, that it ties in nicely with the climate solutions proposed publicly nowadays and I suspect that it has going on for quite a while under the research tag, and we will probably see an official announcement of such a program in the near future. Of course, because I can always be wrong about these things, I have an alternate idea going that it's a saturation thing, due to whatever is going on in the upper atmosphere, and the trails no longer dissipate as they used to. So in that respect, it could indeed be a side effect, and not at all by design as you say.
I still think there is something fishy about it though.
Also, if you want to compare to pictures from the past, the most significant thing that has changed over time with regards to flight travel is the sheer amount of it. Cast your eyes left towards the 80s here and you're talking, what, six times less flights?
(https://transportgeography.org/wp-content/uploads/world_air_travel.png)
So with six times more flights, you should expect six times more of all kinds of contrails, added to which you've conditioned yourself in more recent life to pay more attention to them when they persist. I don't know what the specific increase of air travel over Ireland since the 80s is, but if there's a global average, I wouldn't be surprised if we're above it, since we weren't exactly flowing with cash back then, nor had airline deregulation and the budget airline craze (which we played a large part in) kicked off.
None of that exactly disproves anything, but they are factors of striking magnitude that you haven't mentioned/accounted for.
Whatever the fuck it was they pumped out over Germany certainly did make them chill out somewhat :laugh:
Quote from: astfgyl on July 06, 2020, 03:41:08 PM
I found it equally amazing during lock down, where air traffic was operating at about one tenth of its' usual amount, that the amount of trails in the sky remained unchanged. But as I said to the other fella, don't mind what you can see with your own two eyes, just google the answer to try refute what you think I'm saying...
Nah there was an absolutely massive drop in the amount of trails. I live near enough to the airport and it was very noticeable, I even had my four year old kid asking where the planes feathers (as she calls them) had all gone
...
...
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on July 06, 2020, 06:11:28 PM
Also, if you want to compare to pictures from the past, the most significant thing that has changed over time with regards to flight travel is the sheer amount of it. Cast your eyes left towards the 80s here and you're talking, what, six times less flights?
So with six times more flights, you should expect six times more of all kinds of contrails, added to which you've conditioned yourself in more recent life to pay more attention to them when they persist. I don't know what the specific increase of air travel over Ireland since the 80s is, but if there's a global average, I wouldn't be surprised if we're above it, since we weren't exactly flowing with cash back then, nor had airline deregulation and the budget airline craze (which we played a large part in) kicked off.
None of that exactly disproves anything, but they are factors of striking magnitude that you haven't mentioned/accounted for.
Good point that I indeed hadn't mentioned. Which brings me back to the saturation thing I was proposing a few posts ago, that maybe something's changed in the atmosphere as a whole because of the sheer volume of flights and keeps the contrails persistent, due to increased levels of idunno? I admit also that since I first took notice, I have indeed conditioned myself to noticing them, but then I think because they are so noticeable how has anyone become conditioned to not noticing them all the time?
Quote from: Trev on July 06, 2020, 06:22:54 PM
Nah there was an absolutely massive drop in the amount of trails. I live near enough to the airport and it was very noticeable, I even had my four year old kid asking where the planes feathers (as she calls them) had all gone
I found in the first week or so that there was a noticeable lack of trails, too. Then after that, it seemed to just pick back up again as normal and the whole sky was gridded in as usual. It doesn't seem to be constant anyway, but it's really visible when it gets going. I'm in Tipp btw, not too close to any airport. Shannon is a little over an hour away, Cork a little bit more.
Another thing, I should have worded my OP differently because now I'm here going on for pages about this and I have no real desire to make anyone else believe it. I don't have proof and I'm loath to be lumped in with the "chemtrails poisoning us all" thing, which I don't believe either but looking at what I'm looking at all the time, I feel it isn't just nothing or the accepted narrative. I also only have observational evidence and a gut feeling which counts for fuck all, unless one happens to be already a bit suspect of the thing. I honestly expect a public program of this to be announced in the next couple of years.
Quote from: mugz on July 06, 2020, 07:13:35 PM
Quote from: astfgyl on July 06, 2020, 05:31:15 PM
Quote from: Kunt 4 Life on July 06, 2020, 05:22:12 PM
There was a good documentary called JFK the secret killer or something that put forward the theory (using the Warren report) that the second shot that blew Kennedy's head off was actually a misfire from one of the agents in the car behind who had all been drinking the night before. JFKs brain had been taken away before the autopsy because according to the FBI the family wanted it...hmmm.
The thing that I do like about that theory that does bring a little tear to my eye is, if true, that guy made a really big fuck up but his work colleaguess all worked like bastards and helped to cover it up.
Fucking up at work..uh oh
Mates who got your back... priceless
Can't remember where I saw it, but I was reading something which proposed that George Bush senior was the orchestrator of that assassination. Maybe not reading actually, I think it was the Bright Insight channel on youtube where I came across that one. There are so many theories regarding the how and why of that one, it's hard to keep up with them all.
The Kurt Cobain didn't shoot himself is another one that has been doing the rounds over the years, but I haven't seen anything convincing about it. I suppose that doesn't really count though as it's more of a whodunnit than a cover up thing. I think he did it himself anyway.
Look, I can lead you down the oath to where I am now worldview-wise, but you'll have to be comfortable abandoning stuff you thought was 'solid'. Also people who already know some of these 'truths' will a: mock you b: misdirect you.
I'll be thefirst to admit that I know nothing at all, but I can explain what they 'don't want' us to know, even if there are so many secrets that the ones they've allowed to flow out into common perception are basically are childrens stories, upsetting as they are.
One of my favourite sayings is that the only thing I know for certain is that I don't really know anything at all, so I'd be open to reading or watching pretty much anything. When I really think about it, I can find myself wondering if I exist at all. I actually watched a great BBC doc called "what is reality" a couple of years ago which set me off thinking a rake of mad shit for weeks about perception and if everything is only as experienced by the observer anyway, does anything actually have form or colour or anything. Also another great one BBC did about infinity really got me thinking about how paradoxical that concept is as well, that it simply must be and also cannot be in any way I can really grasp. The fact that physicists have been arguing about it for so long leads me to believe that no one else has much of a grasp on it either.
So yeah, if you have any good links fire them up.
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Quote from: astfgyl on July 06, 2020, 07:24:33 PM
Quote from: mugz on July 06, 2020, 07:13:35 PM
Quote from: astfgyl on July 06, 2020, 05:31:15 PM
Quote from: Kunt 4 Life on July 06, 2020, 05:22:12 PM
There was a good documentary called JFK the secret killer or something that put forward the theory (using the Warren report) that the second shot that blew Kennedy's head off was actually a misfire from one of the agents in the car behind who had all been drinking the night before. JFKs brain had been taken away before the autopsy because according to the FBI the family wanted it...hmmm.
The thing that I do like about that theory that does bring a little tear to my eye is, if true, that guy made a really big fuck up but his work colleaguess all worked like bastards and helped to cover it up.
Fucking up at work..uh oh
Mates who got your back... priceless
Can't remember where I saw it, but I was reading something which proposed that George Bush senior was the orchestrator of that assassination. Maybe not reading actually, I think it was the Bright Insight channel on youtube where I came across that one. There are so many theories regarding the how and why of that one, it's hard to keep up with them all.
The Kurt Cobain didn't shoot himself is another one that has been doing the rounds over the years, but I haven't seen anything convincing about it. I suppose that doesn't really count though as it's more of a whodunnit than a cover up thing. I think he did it himself anyway.
Look, I can lead you down the oath to where I am now worldview-wise, but you'll have to be comfortable abandoning stuff you thought was 'solid'. Also people who already know some of these 'truths' will a: mock you b: misdirect you.
I'll be thefirst to admit that I know nothing at all, but I can explain what they 'don't want' us to know, even if there are so many secrets that the ones they've allowed to flow out into common perception are basically are childrens stories, upsetting as they are.
One of my favourite sayings is that the only thing I know for certain is that I don't really know anything at all, so I'd be open to reading or watching pretty much anything. When I really think about it, I can find myself wondering if I exist at all. I actually watched a great BBC doc called "what is reality" a couple of years ago which set me off thinking a rake of mad shit for weeks about perception and if everything is only as experienced by the observer anyway, does anything actually have form or colour or anything. Also another great one BBC did about infinity really got me thinking about how paradoxical that concept is as well, that it simply must be and also cannot be in any way I can really grasp. The fact that physicists have been arguing about it for so long leads me to believe that no one else has much of a grasp on it either.
So yeah, if you have any good links fire them up.
was the infinity thing the one with Brian Cox... if so, everything about that was really evil. Brian Cox is 'unreliable'... ALL those types are kind of trying to destroy your sense of self. Dawkins, Cox, Kaku, Greene, Sagan, Feynman...but the details of how that works are upsetting, and I don't know who's shitting me along, and who genuinely doesn't know.
I heard Cox once state in a podcast that "data is just data" (implying that it can't lie) and he's since been firmly on the "enemies of deep thinking" list. (Data is as much conditioned on theory as theory is conditioned on data, is the truth he was intentionally obfuscating to the public mind. I'd go along with calling that a type of evil. Plus, he was talking about genetics, which he has no expertise in.)
Quote from: mugz on July 06, 2020, 07:07:50 PM
Quote from: Carnage on July 06, 2020, 04:32:08 PM
Can we just call this thread 'The Tin Foil Hat Brigade' and be done with it?
you're not really in a position to say that when your have a goatagram as your avatar
Have you looked at it closely? It's like totally serious.
How are the details of how it works upsetting, Mugz?
Genuinely intrigued, not shitting you along.
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The BBC doc I watched about infinity didn't have Brian Cox in it. I'll look it up and fire up a link for anyone interested. It's grand to sit back at times and think about stuff like that, which I'll never get to the bottom of, as it somewhat flexes the brain. As much as these lads on most of the docs are entry level stuff, I still think they are capable of providing me with entertainment. Feynman for example has a sort of contagious enthusiasm about him and even if I was in disagreement with him, it's difficult for me to see him and Cox and the likes of Marcus Du Sautoy as evil or being intentionally misleading even though they all have a point of their own to push.
I'd love to see where you are getting your ideas from Mugz. You seem like a learned enough fellow but at the same time very reluctant to point anyone towards where you're getting this from. Like the four points you wrote out for me are extremely difficult to accept as anything other than some cryptic thing that I'm not smart enough to understand. If you could simplify it a bit for the uninitiated I'd certainly read into it. Is there a 101 video or anything like that?
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I wonder if what everyone is allowed to know is so limited, do BigMac and Scathach know any more than you do really? Or more than I do for that matter?
Not really being smart here, I would just like to know where ye lads get the info from beyond a general feeling that everything is wrong. Like I feel that covid and George Floyd are being manipulated on a grand scale but I have no idea to what end beyond the selling of things and the making of money, and the chances are that there is no grand plan and instead lots of mini plans at play at once but all involving the making of money. The other idea I have around the covid is the simple one, that no one really understands it yet because it's too new and as mundane as that seems I wouldn't rule that possibility out either.
I think there are lots of the theories that have foundation, like I think 9/11 was a sort of false flag thing, but I wouldn't be into the whole "truther" thing, and I don't see how my thoughts around the demolition of the WTCs might naturally lead to thinking the earth is flat or that we're all living in the matrix. Like we are only living in a subjective reality, but that is true for all creatures is it not
Banana-nose Maldonado shot JFK. :laugh: Nothing is true, everything is permitted.
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Quote from: mugz on July 07, 2020, 12:06:55 AM
Quote from: astfgyl on July 06, 2020, 11:51:24 PM
I wonder if what everyone is allowed to know is so limited, do BigMac and Scathach know any more than you do really? Or more than I do for that matter?
Not really being smart here, I would just like to know where ye lads get the info from beyond a general feeling that everything is wrong. Like I feel that covid and George Floyd are being manipulated on a grand scale but I have no idea to what end beyond the selling of things and the making of money, and the chances are that there is no grand plan and instead lots of mini plans at play at once but all involving the making of money. The other idea I have around the covid is the simple one, that no one really understands it yet because it's too new and as mundane as that seems I wouldn't rule that possibility out either.
I think there are lots of the theories that have foundation, like I think 9/11 was a sort of false flag thing, but I wouldn't be into the whole "truther" thing, and I don't see how my thoughts around the demolition of the WTCs might naturally lead to thinking the earth is flat or that we're all living in the matrix. Like we are only living in a subjective reality, but that is true for all creatures is it not
well in the last 5 years I've learned to spot people who know a lot. in fairness many will tell you directly if they think you can handle it, and you're clever enough to cope. so while I know some stuff I'm fully aware it's kind of throwaway stuff for people who are determined to know, but can't be relied on to cope with real knowledge
the name George in itself is one small clue, but a rose by any other name, actually one thing I did learn a long time ago is trust noone, and play a very tight game, and while some might slag you off, don't be afraid to ask childish questions- in some ways you get proper answers. Nothing's quite how it seems, but knowing that is kinda a burden.
I am having a hard time deciding if you are taking the piss or not. Have you any actual anything you can tell me, so I may have the option of considering it or are you genuinely going to keep giving the Sunday Independent Cryptic Clue type of answer?
Quote from: Scáthach on July 06, 2020, 11:52:54 PM
Nothing is true, everything is permitted.
Care to elaborate?
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I feel like I'm getting some undue credit here, what have I said that would make you think I know more than you, mugz?
Seems like you've dug far deeper into many things than I.
I can't verify much of what you've said, but you've some interesting ideas.
Having had some mad experiences myself, I'm open to the idea of reality being far more than what it seems, but I'm none the wiser these days about what that could be.
There's this quite fascinating three part documentary called Cracking the Shakespeare Code, which on the surface is an exploration of the "conspiracy theory" that Shakespeare was actually Francis Bacon. But if you watch the whole thing from a detached vantage point, with respect to any commitment regarding the true biographical person of the Bard, then what you also get is an almost three hour unfolding observational study of the pattern-forming mind at its most unbridled; exegesis led almost entirely by a doctrine of signatures and resemblance, applied meticulously but liberally to all and sundry, just to get everything to fit a narrative. Which, in light of the Francis Bacon quote I placed in my first post here, is ironic to say the least.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNL0XODSMwU
In order to know the world, it is at least as important in parallel to try to "know thyself", since the unfettered self, endlessly auto-confirming, is the worst enemy of insight.
Quote from: astfgyl on July 06, 2020, 11:51:24 PM
I think there are lots of the theories that have foundation, like I think 9/11 was a sort of false flag thing, but I wouldn't be into the whole "truther" thing, and I don't see how my thoughts around the demolition of the WTCs might naturally lead to thinking the earth is flat or that we're all living in the matrix. Like we are only living in a subjective reality, but that is true for all creatures is it not
I think some of that is purposely done.
The Conspiracy Theory umbrella purposely incorporates some unbelievable and easily ridiculed ideas, so when something they don't want you to investigate is labelled a 'Conspiracy Theory', mentioning it to other people immediately evokes mockery, and condescension, and images of you believing lizards control the flat earth via 5G.
Essentially, pertinent topics that get labelled as Conspiracy Theories, have their own built in defence mechanisms.
Postulate, for practical purposes, an infinite number of freely acting, pattern recognizing, theory generating agents; place all of them in an insurmountably complex, plastic and modifiable environment; this system will return an exponentially increasing number of theories over time, tending asymptotically towards an infinite number. There is no "they" who are independent of that system; there's only an "us", complicating things for ourselves by the very act of trying to simplify them; Ptolemaics furiously drawing epicycles all over existence, saving whatever appearances we are personally attached to.
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Quote from: Scáthach on July 06, 2020, 11:52:54 PM
Nothing is true, everything is permitted.
Care to elaborate?
[/quote]
Just dropping a cryptic joke. As a saying, it's attributed to Hassan I Sabbah, founder of the cult of the Assassins. They were based in the middle East and known for infiltrating enemy organisations and waiting for the opportunity to kill their intended targets. Usually being killed themselves in the process, but they knew they could be assured their 72 virgins in paradise as martyrs.
The saying, in its original context meant the assassins were free to act in ways that were contrary to their faith or ethics, because their actions were for the greater good.
I first heard about Hassan I Sabbah in Illuminatus!, an excellent novel by Robert Anton Wilson, which is also where the reference to Banana nose Maldonado comes from. I'd highly recommend it, its setting is basically the soup of conspiracies popular in the 60s/70s with a healthy dose of humour, surrealism and drugs.
I've read other stuff on the Assassins by Idries Shah, a renowned author on mystical Islam/Sufism.
There is a dubious etymology of Hashishim (assassins) being the source of cannabis resin being called hashish, supposedly enjoying some cannabis as they carried out their holy murder.
There is Occultist conspiracy theories about The Knights Templar making contact with the Assassins and adopting some of their heresies, thus leading to the Templars downfall and persecution when returning to Europe.
(Phew, sorry to drone on but you did say elaborate :laugh:)
Edited- Sabbah not Sabbath, damn autocorrect
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Quote from: mugz on July 07, 2020, 12:15:09 PM
I got the impression from you and Scathach that you'd be well up on on the pagan and satanic cults, from the book thread, and I suppose it's all on my mind anyway given the oddness of the world currently.
Ah right, I get you now.
Yeah I've varying degrees of interest in those topics, it's been a while since I've read up on any of it though.
I found Fosforos to be intriguing, hard to wrap the head around, but worth a look for anyone interested in that end of things. Starting with "This is a difficult, irritating book".
Suppose the whole Satanic thing is a Conspiracy Theory in and of itself.
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on July 07, 2020, 12:03:51 PM
Postulate, for practical purposes, an infinite number of freely acting, pattern recognizing, theory generating agents; place all of them in an insurmountably complex, plastic and modifiable environment; this system will return an exponentially increasing number of theories over time, tending asymptotically towards an infinite number. There is no "they" who are independent of that system; there's only an "us", complicating things for ourselves by the very act of trying to simplify them; Ptolemaics furiously drawing epicycles all over existence, saving whatever appearances we are personally attached to.
This is a point of view that resonates strongly with me, and written more succinctly and eloquently than I could have. There are as many points of view in the world as there are people that can effectively experience and communicate them.
In this way, it's a type of neurological relativity that gives validity to a person's experiences. Whether that's a person's religious or ethical faith, being abducted by aliens or seeing the chupacabra. It doesn't mean those persons experiences have any validity or meaning to anyone else, but it also doesn't negate their reality to the percipient.
Quote from: Scáthach on July 07, 2020, 02:18:12 PM
it also doesn't negate their reality to the percipient.
...a reality which is itself an integral part of the autopoietic whole. Committing to any single world-view, having knowledge there is a multitude, is a strangely limiting path to pursue, and proselytizing any single one in a blanket fashion, again having knowledge there is a multitude, seems reckless but could also be due to being jaded.
In summary of what I said above there, the defining feature of conspiracy theory, as far as I can see, is the division of the whole into they/us, subjugater/subjugated, subject/object. A category error of the highest order, and it's at that order that exists an "umbrella" under which all such theories fall. The reality that I see is more dynamic, but not so much in a dialectical as in a duplicitous sense; there is definitely a trickery to it, but there's just as much trickery to the sense of thinking you've got it. The physiological sensation that accompanies eureka insights makes them the very height of treachery and duplicity, on a core existential level.
Bingpot!
It's all here ->
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1EA2ohrt5Q
Quote from: The Butcher on July 07, 2020, 03:33:17 PM
It's all here ->
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1EA2ohrt5Q
Second time that's been posted in two different threads in a couple of weeks :laugh: :abbath:
It really is worth noting that ex-communist party members, whether they were native US citizens or Soviet born or whatever, were under an obligation to condemn the communist party: simply leaving the party wasn't considered proof enough to clear your name or reputation, rather public declarations of condemnation were required. This was the driving force behind the publication of The God That Failed (for the heavy metal reference), in which six intellectuals confessed their "Kronstadt" moment of realization at how utterly wrong they had been. It's a very interesting read (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_God_that_Failed), one which I find particularly interesting because of Koestler's contribution; when he describes his "conversion" to communism in terms similar to a brain-washing, it is eerily similar to his description in The Sleepwalkers of what Kepler felt when he had his (ultimately entirely fictional) revelation of the solar system being arranged according to the Platonic forms.
I was reading somewhere a while ago that Yuri was fired, or intimidated, or something to that extent, by Justin Trudeau's father Pierre. This then led to reading the rather entertaining theory that Fidel Castro is Justin's illegitimate father.
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Quote from: mugz on July 07, 2020, 06:38:43 PM
Quote from: Bigmac on July 07, 2020, 03:56:34 PM
I was reading somewhere a while ago that Yuri was fired, or intimidated, or something to that extent, by Justin Trudeau's father Pierre. This then led to reading the rather entertaining theory that Fidel Castro is Justin's illegitimate father.
Incidentally it's worth noting that you don't get fired from intelligence stuff, you 'move' somewhere else, or they trigger some of the cognitive switches they've conditioned into you, and you become so outlandish you can't be taken seriously/you kill yourself.
There's a lot going on with david kelly and the skripals, and david shayler (just 3 that come to mind). So for Bezmenov to turn up elsewhere means he might have been a triple agent, or just a regular agent whose trip to the west was by design.
My first thought after watching Bezmenov's interview was that he was a regular agent rather than a defector. As it is, listening to his solution could only bring further chaos to proceedings. Or to put it another way his solution is actually the problem. Divide and conquer in the most classic sense.
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Quote from: mugz on July 07, 2020, 06:30:36 PM
Now, it may be that this is all us against ourselves, but that only means we're sick in ourselves, rather having having sickness brought upon us.
"Sickness" in the sense you mean it is nothing more than an anthropocentric value judgement imposed on the world. What is "norm"? What is "pathological"? Is health an absence of sickness? Or is health a robust capacity to recover from sickness? If it's the latter, then the end does justify the means, since the end result is a more robust, resistant entity. But without accurate teleological revelation, which for argument's sake let's say doesn't exist, it is impossible to say at any point whether something designated as sickness is part of a steady and inexorable decline or rather a temporary sickness leading to a subsequent re-valuated strengthening. On a psychological level, these questions are hot topics with respect to "PC culture" - egos that are too easily bruised many worry will lead to a weakening of the human mind, etc. -, but they also have a much more fundamental evolutionary and physiological underpinning; in evolution, new functions of old machinery are often utterly feeble at first, but they only have to confer the smallest amount of evolutionary advantage in order to shift onto the adaptation ladder and then become stronger generation after generation. But in order to apprehend values at that level, you're talking about expanding your scope of things to scales of tens of thousands of years rather than a narrow envelope of a couple of hundred running backwards and a couple of decades running forward. At that grander scale, "sickness" is meaningless, since the present sickness of some life forms will be the future fertilizer of others. This has happened several times, on local and global scales, over the course of evolutionary history. In brief, this boils down to it ultimately being our choice whether we evaluate things as "sick" or not, a decision I'd recommend making based on which choice will confer the greatest vigor/capacity for assimilation of experience to the individual in the present. Choosing to see things as "sick" doesn't seem to do one much good, and since we're all just a short straw and a blink of the eye away from eternal self-loss...
Quote from: mugz on July 07, 2020, 06:30:36 PM
So while autopoiesis is a fun word, it only talks about cybernetics, and by definition cybernetics can't be unitary, so universalism/solipsism both fall down, and autopoiesis can't be a thing.
I can think of several conceptual systems in which cybernetics either is or would be unitary, but in any case the premise is false: autopoiesis doesn't "only talk about cybernetics." But in any case, I was using it in its most general sense; we call our own reality into being and while away our existence propping that up. Or, to go back to the opposition inherent to conspiracy theory; if there is a "they", then every "we" gets the "they" it deserves.
It's my duty, I'm a missionary
Sacred, holy
To put it in words, to write it down
That is walking, on hallowed ground
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on July 07, 2020, 08:00:06 PM
Quote from: mugz on July 07, 2020, 06:30:36 PM
Now, it may be that this is all us against ourselves, but that only means we're sick in ourselves, rather having having sickness brought upon us.
"Sickness" in the sense you mean it is nothing more than an anthropocentric value judgement imposed on the world. What is "norm"? What is "pathological"? Is health an absence of sickness? Or is health a robust capacity to recover from sickness? If it's the latter, then the end does justify the means, since the end result is a more robust, resistant entity. But without accurate teleological revelation, which for argument's sake let's say doesn't exist, it is impossible to say at any point whether something designated as sickness is part of a steady and inexorable decline or rather a temporary sickness leading to a subsequent re-valuated strengthening. On a psychological level, these questions are hot topics with respect to "PC culture" - egos that are too easily bruised many worry will lead to a weakening of the human mind, etc. -, but they also have a much more fundamental evolutionary and physiological underpinning; in evolution, new functions of old machinery are often utterly feeble at first, but they only have to confer the smallest amount of evolutionary advantage in order to shift onto the adaptation ladder and then become stronger generation after generation. But in order to apprehend values at that level, you're talking about expanding your scope of things to scales of tens of thousands of years rather than a narrow envelope of a couple of hundred running backwards and a couple of decades running forward. At that grander scale, "sickness" is meaningless, since the present sickness of some life forms will be the future fertilizer of others. This has happened several times, on local and global scales, over the course of evolutionary history. In brief, this boils down to it ultimately being our choice whether we evaluate things as "sick" or not, a decision I'd recommend making based on which choice will confer the greatest vigor/capacity for assimilation of experience to the individual in the present. Choosing to see things as "sick" doesn't seem to do one much good, and since we're all just a short straw and a blink of the eye away from eternal self-loss...
Quote from: mugz on July 07, 2020, 06:30:36 PM
So while autopoiesis is a fun word, it only talks about cybernetics, and by definition cybernetics can't be unitary, so universalism/solipsism both fall down, and autopoiesis can't be a thing.
I can think of several conceptual systems in which cybernetics either is or would be unitary, but in any case the premise is false: autopoiesis doesn't "only talk about cybernetics." But in any case, I was using it in its most general sense; we call our own reality into being and while away our existence propping that up. Or, to go back to the opposition inherent to conspiracy theory; if there is a "they", then every "we" gets the "they" it deserves.
Indeed, autopoiesis is almost always used in it's most general sense.
Last sentence was top notch though. I can get on board with that.
A good Depeche Mode lyric can be used to settle any semantic argument as well, thank god
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I read up there on the rainbows and it seems logical enough. Didn't find anything too crazy about the Isle of Man at a glance, apart from the fact they seem to have had their own thing going on there for a long time.
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I did a quick check there typing in "native american culture hoax". I mostly seem to be getting stuff about folks falsely claiming to be of Native American descent. Is there more to it than that? I can't try go too deep into the results as I have the dinner going as well
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"It just bums me out how much of my life I wasted reading history books or learning about different cultures around the world, and it turns out not to be the way it seems."
Certainly no better reason than that to switch to the furthest out narratives you can find! Hopefully they'll be entertaining enough in their own right that you won't also regret that use of time some day. But for the love of the gods, throw astfgyl the name of a book or blog or two; I think even poor Fyodor is starting to salivate for the number of unrewarded cues.
Quote from: mugz on July 08, 2020, 05:35:29 PM
It just bums me out how much of my life I wasted reading history books or learning about different cultures around the world, and it turns out not to be the way it seems.
In relation to this, I found the below series to be a good watch, the delivery is excellent.
Clocks in at 5 or 6 hours so far I think, as it's not yet finished. But what has been put out so far, I found enjoyable.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eOM2fT6tBFE
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Quote from: mugz on July 08, 2020, 07:26:04 PM
having said that, I probably will watch all of that later tonight ::)
Yeah sound, I'd be interested to hear how it ties into your own ideas about history not being what it appears to be.
Quote from: Bigmac on July 08, 2020, 07:16:36 PM
In relation to this, I found the below series to be a good watch, the delivery is excellent.
Clocks in at 5 or 6 hours so far I think, as it's not yet finished. But what has been put out so far, I found enjoyable.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eOM2fT6tBFE
Sound, I'll have a look at that too. Flicking through quickly there, it looks to be coming from the same angle as another six-hourer I watched a few years back about the post-hoc WWII narrative written by the USSR, the USA, Great Britain, and France. When you string their names together like that, as authors, you'd be mad to think anything they all agreed on could be 100% kosher (pun intended).
The main problem I found with that doc was that a lot of the alternative narrative it presented was ultra conservative (in a Vargian "traditional wife" kinda sense) and also based on things etymologists, philologists and anthropologists/ethnologists had already been "debunking" in the 19th century. I watched all of that, but if the genetic purity myths over-ride too much, I don't think I'll last the full six hours on this one.
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Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on July 08, 2020, 08:00:11 PM
When you string their names together like that, as authors, you'd be mad to think anything they all agreed on could be 100% kosher (pun intended).
I enjoyed that pun.
What was the documentary you watched? Seems like it could be up my street.
Yeah the stage setting seems to go into the reasoning behind it a bit more, but the later ones focus more on the history itself. I just find the delivery very listenable, if that makes sense. Sometimes you encounter something with good information, but the presentation can make it difficult to take in.
What parts have been debunked already? It's something I found really intriguing upon first watch, but a clearer picture of what parts should be scrutinised would be sound.
Quote from: mugz on July 08, 2020, 08:06:49 PM
I'm a couple notches further along from swastikas, pyramids, and thor heyerdahl.
So what's the sequence of notches to where you are now?
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Quote from: mugz on July 08, 2020, 05:35:29 PM
I'm in no way saying any of this is true, or meaningful, or that I know anything about anything. I'm just saying that things are complicated, and it can be useful to process stuff that seems silly, since even if it is silly, your brain appreciates the workout.
The native american thing is one version, but it's a routine that applies to other cultures too, like the amish/mennonites, and so on and so forth.
It just bums me out how much of my life I wasted reading history books or learning about different cultures around the world, and it turns out not to be the way it seems.
As to why that stuff is the way it is, there are many reasons, but I don't know if any of them are true, but then again maybe it's just me being a bit thick, being led down the garden path.
The more interesting culture hoaxes are Roman, and Norse.
China is interesting too, but that one gets very dark very quickly.
Ah here...that is an incredibly vague explanation of a fairly specific statement "there are no Amish". Unless of course you are just being deliberately flippant. Like what exactly do you mean by a culture hoax? And please...give us an actual example.
The WWII one was deleted off YouTube a few years back, I can't remember the name of it.
This one you've posted is, I'm afraid, extremely weak. The guy tells us he does his best to go only to original sources wherever he can (this is good), then two minutes later uses a screenshot of a tweet from some randomer as the only proof of what, if you try to research it, seems to be a completely fabricated accusation against the Swedish minister for culture. A screenshot of a tweet is, however, apparently enough to get dozens of convinced and outraged comments, which collect thousands of likes from the key demographic. A screenshot of a tweet... and the guy has the balls just beforehand to talk about "useful idiots" as if it's something he could never be. That alone should be enough to have your own alarm bells screeching; a piece of info which fits his world-view narrative can be assimilated and spread on the basis of a screenshot of a tweet (the mind boggles), yet the schtick he's selling - so I'm presuming it's what he'll do - is him bending over backwards to explain away any info which doesn't fit his world-view narrative. That said, his videos may still be entertaining and contain references to some things that are genuinely worth following up, but whatever analysis is his own can't be worth much at all I'm afraid, except here and there by accident. The whole intro is built on false premises
The debunking stuff was referring to that other WWII doc, but since yer man mentions it here too, the very idea that there was a total learned consensus on race science prior to WWII is simply false. There was a narrative that was louder than the others (Galton, Spencer, etc.), but there were already plenty of dissenting voices, and we have no lack of primary sources for this. Seems funny he accepts that the loudest voice today serves the interests of a ruling narrative but doesn't get that this has always been the case, hence prior to WWII also.
Yeah you're right, I just let that part go by without much question but it does seem unfounded. Unless it has been buried... badum tish.
I was actually laughing at the useful idiots mention when skimming through it again. Our friend Yuri seems to really crop up everywhere.
What would the alternatives or dissenting voices be to what he's presenting here?
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Quote from: mugz on July 08, 2020, 09:01:49 PM
traps are relevant on a few levels
I've never liked anime.
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on July 08, 2020, 07:06:59 PM
for the love of the gods, throw astfgyl the name of a book or blog or two; I think even poor Fyodor is starting to salivate for the number of unrewarded cues.
You do know I don't actually expect an answer, but I can't help my curiosity when someone tells me that planes are sort of submarines and submarines aren't really a thing at all. I'm not going to get into anything like ridicule on that, I genuinely get curious as to what sources could lead to those conclusions.
and in fairness Mugz, you did give a general list a few posts back there on the type of stuff, just again no specifics. I do also think most of history, by its' very nature is misreported and false narratives are spun throughout history. I mean there is access to everything now and we can all see how things are spun wildly in one direction or another so imagine how bad things were historically when the sources were so limited? The nature of reality itself is up for constant debate anyway, so all things are possible but I fail to be able to stretch to things like the flat earth theory, although I would still watch a video that makes the argument.
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Quote from: mugz on July 08, 2020, 08:58:06 PM
and also I dont want to waste anyones time.
It would seem the cryptic answers are achieving this, though.
I would genuinely be intrigued by what you seem to know, and I'd watch or read some sources you think are valuable in pursuing such knowledge, but the lack of any kind of direction beyond further riddles kind of grows weary after a while.
Quote from: astfgyl on July 08, 2020, 09:14:04 PM
You do know I don't actually expect an answer, but I can't help my curiosity when someone tells me that planes are sort of submarines and submarines aren't really a thing at all. I'm not going to get into anything like ridicule on that, I genuinely get curious as to what sources could lead to those conclusions.
Yeah, I'm in a similar way of thinking myself.
Just typed a search for "planes are submarines". What has life become.
you too? lol I typed that in a few days ago
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So the first article I can see from all unreal (https://allunreal.com/blog/game-of-thrones-target-aryans/#more-1733), relates to Jewish control of the media, Holocaust skepticism, and how Targaryan's are 'Target Aryans'.
An interesting little play on words, not sure if I entirely buy that as their intent though.
Anyway, the general idea is there's little word twists like that hidden in popular media?
Well I'm in that boat about the theories, as in believing them or not doesn't take from my interest in them
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It reminds me a bit of this blog here, which you may enjoy perusing:
https://www.kalkiweisthor.net/
Perhaps of particular interest in this setting as it does cover some metal topics.
Along with other things such as musing about Hitler's God, comparing the O9A stuff (mentioned in the book thread) to the Temple of the Black Light (Jon Nodtveidt), and things like the black, white and red of the National Socialist flag representing the Nigredo, Albedo, Rubedo of alchemy.
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https://www.olddublintown.com/swastika-laundry.html
:laugh:
I hear der Fuhrers relative worked in the Shelbourne.
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Quote from: Scáthach on July 08, 2020, 10:25:18 PM
https://www.olddublintown.com/swastika-laundry.html
:laugh:
I hear der Fuhrers relative worked in the Shelbourne.
Yeah I remember seeing those photos a few years ago, I hadn't realised it was still on display until the 1980's.
"So, Mr Britain what's with the hakenkreuz?"
"I just think it looks nice"
:laugh:
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Strange to think it's only the second most evil laundry in Ireland's history.
Quote from: Bigmac on July 08, 2020, 10:38:30 PM
Strange to think it's only the second most evil laundry in Ireland's history.
Cleanliness is next to godliness, and whether that's ethnic cleanliness or laundered money, the love of it is the root of all evil. Or something.
Quote from: Scáthach on July 08, 2020, 10:25:18 PM
https://www.olddublintown.com/swastika-laundry.html
:laugh:
I hear der Fuhrers relative worked in the Shelbourne.
Wow :laugh:
Yeah it's a nutty one all right. But it's not as if our glorious old sod wasn't fond of the fascists.
Wasn't Dev one of the first heads of state to commiserate the Reich on the loss of herr Hitler.
Our bishops giving the Roman salute to the blueshirts off to fight for Franco in the Spanish civil war is a famous image. (Forgive the lack of a link I'm feeling lazy and enjoying some beer.)
And Mugz, as to why nobody has really mentioned the Swastika Laundry, I would imagine it's good old Catholic shame. I think every family of our current generations has personal knowledge (whether first or second hand) of the laundries or mother and baby homes.
My own middle name was the birth name of a boy born in a mother and baby home. He was born to my uncles girlfriend and taken for adoption during my own mother's pregnancy. I have a cousin out there I've never met and never will.
Sure it's a great little country.
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Quote from: Scáthach on July 08, 2020, 10:25:18 PM
https://www.olddublintown.com/swastika-laundry.html
:laugh:
I hear der Fuhrers relative worked in the Shelbourne.
I remember my old man telling me about seeing their vans around Dublin in the past, I didn't realise it was that recent (he was born in '39, I thought he was referring to the '50s or '60s). Odd one alright.
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You'll have to let us know what they thought of Gorefest if you run into them again! :abbath:
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Quote from: mugz on July 09, 2020, 12:31:03 AM
De Valera being Jewish himself puts a different spin on the Nazi thing...
I found this a bit mad when I came across it:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%89amon_de_Valera_Forest
Quote from: mugz on July 09, 2020, 12:31:03 AM
De Valera being Jewish himself puts a different spin on the Nazi thing...
Quote from: mugz on July 09, 2020, 12:41:19 AM
I found myself having a temporal blip the other day- some teenage girls were listening to Muse on a portable speaker two benches down, and there was me tapping away, rocking out, and they started chatting away, and then they asked me for any recommendations for other 'retro' music..and it was like the 2nd to most recent Muse album too.
Jews/clues/Muse... Matt Bellamy is a Devalera clone
Quote from: mugz on July 09, 2020, 12:31:03 AM
De Valera being Jewish himself puts a different spin on the Nazi thing...
Was he yeah?
Of course, the nose...
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Quote from: Bigmac on July 09, 2020, 07:02:37 AM
Quote from: mugz on July 09, 2020, 12:31:03 AM
De Valera being Jewish himself puts a different spin on the Nazi thing...
I found this a bit mad when I came across it:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%89amon_de_Valera_Forest
Well, you think you know someone...then...
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/culture/books/ireland-and-the-nazis-a-troubled-history-1.3076579%3fmode=amp
Its bizarre where people from Irish history turn up. I remember reading somewhere a good few years ago about a restaurant in either Pakistan or Afghanistan where meals were named after martyrs to the cause against Western imperialism. You could order, I shit you not, a Bobby Sands burger. :laugh:
Yeah there's a Bobby Sands Street in Tehran too, the British embassy is beside it :laugh:
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The envoy, Bewley, or the blueshirts, or maybe both (can't remember, going back to secondary school) were behind the "Dev is Jewish" rumour.
Edit: Truncated post. Either way, the rumour goes back to the 30s-40s, and I believe Dev even addressed it in the Dail at some point.
One of the advantages of going to a Gaelscoil was having history teachers who were extremely enthusiastic about Irish history!
Ah yeah the zealous Gaeilgeoirs, always conspicuously Irish.
For secondary I switched between a gaelscoil and a protestant school twice over; whatever about the former, the latter were certainly conspicuously unIrish by comparison!
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Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on July 09, 2020, 11:23:03 PM
The envoy, Bewley, or the blueshirts, or maybe both (can't remember, going back to secondary school) were behind the "Dev is Jewish" rumour.
Any good articles or similar about that? I remember looking into it a while ago, but it seemed a bit of an inconclusive dead end. My digging didn't go very deep though.
On the topic of Jewish history and Ireland, the Wikipedia article about it is entertaining:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_Ireland
90 years after Toirdelbach sent 5 Jews back across the sea, Strongbow appears funded by a Jewish moneylender.
Very unlikely the two events are linked, but it's still entertaining to think that Toirdelbach so incensed them, they funded Strongbow in return.
Quote from: Scáthach on July 09, 2020, 10:41:31 PM
Quote from: Bigmac on July 09, 2020, 07:02:37 AM
Quote from: mugz on July 09, 2020, 12:31:03 AM
De Valera being Jewish himself puts a different spin on the Nazi thing...
I found this a bit mad when I came across it:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%89amon_de_Valera_Forest
Well, you think you know someone...then...
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/culture/books/ireland-and-the-nazis-a-troubled-history-1.3076579%3fmode=amp
Its bizarre where people from Irish history turn up. I remember reading somewhere a good few years ago about a restaurant in either Pakistan or Afghanistan where meals were named after martyrs to the cause against Western imperialism. You could order, I shit you not, a Bobby Sands burger. :laugh:
(https://www.irishcentral.com/uploads/article/83217/cropped_bobby_sands_tehran_.png?t=1578945060)
(https://www.postpravdamagazine.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/IMG_6957.jpg)
(https://images.vice.com/vice/images/articles/meta/2015/01/12/bobby-sands-burgers-tehran-545-1421090781.jpg?crop=1xw:0.7929515418502202xh;center,center&resize=1200:*)
:laugh: Good on ye. That's the one.
I've given a good part of the day laughing at that, it's amazing
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You wouldn't say that if you hadn't eaten in 66 days!
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Clickety click.. Sickety-Sick!
Could have been worse. Could have been 88.
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I wanted the authentic Bobby Sands burger experience, but I was very disappointed there was no shite on the walls :laugh: 1 star review on trip advisor. :laugh:
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on July 10, 2020, 11:00:53 PM
Could have been worse. Could have been 88.
Be fair bad after 66 days with fuck all to 8!
Quote from: mugz on July 10, 2020, 11:19:13 PM
how did you get on with that video- guessing it was old news to you
Not old news but it required a bit of a stretch
Quote from: Scáthach on July 10, 2020, 11:52:29 PM
I wanted the authentic Bobby Sands burger experience, but I was very disappointed there was no shite on the walls :laugh: 1 star review on trip advisor. :laugh:
Sweet jesus.
I got the fuck kicked out of me once for making a joke out of Bobby Sands. Deadly serious. Flogged.
How the fuck was I to know that type of lettuce wasn't right for the signature burger!?
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Quote from: astfgyl on July 11, 2020, 12:00:13 AM
Quote from: Scáthach on July 10, 2020, 11:52:29 PM
I wanted the authentic Bobby Sands burger experience, but I was very disappointed there was no shite on the walls :laugh: 1 star review on trip advisor. :laugh:
Sweet jesus.
I got the fuck kicked out of me once for making a joke out of Bobby Sands. Deadly serious. Flogged.
How the fuck was I to know that type of lettuce wasn't right for the signature burger!?
you don't hear much about iceberg these days
And the romaine stuff is a hoax.
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I think in here people know a bad taste joke is just a joke, thankfully. There are however, pubs I know of where I'd be hung, drawn and quartered for saying less. Ollies bar in Drogheda springs to mind. Hopefully I won't get cancelled :)
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Quote from: Scáthach on July 11, 2020, 09:10:30 PM
I think in here people know a bad taste joke is just a joke, thankfully. There are however, pubs I know of where I'd be hung, drawn and quartered for saying less. Ollies bar in Drogheda springs to mind. Hopefully I won't get cancelled :)
Ah yeah, a joke is a joke. I laughed. But I genuinely did get put in hospital over it before
Quote from: mugz on July 12, 2020, 01:16:47 AM
I learned some interesting things about Narcissus recently, if anyone's interested in mythology; very tied in with current events, and tied in with Norse mythology too.
Do tell on
Quote from: Scáthach on July 11, 2020, 09:10:30 PM
I think in here people know a bad taste joke is just a joke, thankfully. There are however, pubs I know of where I'd be hung, drawn and quartered for saying less. Ollies bar in Drogheda springs to mind. Hopefully I won't get cancelled :)
That's why you go up the steps to the top shop were jokes like that are fine.
D'ya want a chicken supper Bobby Sands.
I heard that when I was young and it was the most bamboozling sentence I'd ever heard up until that point in my life.
Chemical Ally, very reluctantly and after much encouragement, told me a few fenian jokes at a gig years ago, very entertaining precisely because they are offensive and risqué.
Here's one...what do you call a fenian telly tubby?
'Tiocfaidh ár La La'
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Ok, here's one. Not exactly a conspiracy of the traditional kind but more of a mystery thing.
Who is Andrew WK? Anyone familiar with that one?
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No I just remembered it earlier and thought it might be an interesting one outside of the usual lark a thread such as this would entail. It's an interesting one but mostly seems to me like he is playing it up to generate a bit of mystique
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Quote from: astfgyl on July 12, 2020, 09:43:27 PM
Ok, here's one. Not exactly a conspiracy of the traditional kind but more of a mystery thing.
Who is Andrew WK? Anyone familiar with that one?
It is something along the lines of he was manufactured by a record company and the current Andrew WK is a different person than the man from the party hard era.
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Quote from: mickO))) on July 12, 2020, 10:20:17 PM
Quote from: astfgyl on July 12, 2020, 09:43:27 PM
Ok, here's one. Not exactly a conspiracy of the traditional kind but more of a mystery thing.
Who is Andrew WK? Anyone familiar with that one?
It is something along the lines of he was manufactured by a record company and the current Andrew WK is a different person than the man from the party hard era.
Yeah that was it, that there is more than one AWK out there doing the rounds, and the answers he gave about the whole thing only served to perpetuate the idea more than dispel the rumours
Quote from: mugz on July 12, 2020, 10:24:44 PM
Quote from: astfgyl on July 12, 2020, 10:07:44 PM
No I just remembered it earlier and thought it might be an interesting one outside of the usual lark a thread such as this would entail. It's an interesting one but mostly seems to me like he is playing it up to generate a bit of mystique
let us know if anything was helpful with that wk video; it's kind of sort of interesting
Grand I'll get a look at that
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Someone mentioned AWK in a facebook group lately and there were a few posts about how he used to be part of some noise collective years ago, it went on a bit, lads saying they knew him etc. Never knew there was any sort of mystery about it, would like to see that.
Almost as much fun is the whole craic with The Armed. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.vice.com/amp/en_us/article/d3kkea/getting-to-know-the-armed-the-most-unknowable-band-in-hardcore
Good read there on The Armed. So it's Kurt Ballou's thing then? Maybe..
Must take a listen, I've never heard a note of it.
Have a read of the AWK stuff, it's the same type of marketing I think he won't say he is or isn't him. Likely story in my head is that he hired an actor for a gig, and then let the story grow legs by itself
Here's a good summary of the AWK thing as well, for anyone unfamiliar with it https://www.stereogum.com/2015589/andrew-wk-steev-mike/franchises/columns/sounding-board/
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Quote from: astfgyl on July 12, 2020, 11:57:09 PM
Good read there on The Armed. So it's Kurt Ballou's thing then? Maybe..
Must take a listen, I've never heard a note of it.
Have a read of the AWK stuff, it's the same type of marketing I think he won't say he is or isn't him. Likely story in my head is that he hired an actor for a gig, and then let the story grow legs by itself
Here's a good summary of the AWK thing as well, for anyone unfamiliar with it https://www.stereogum.com/2015589/andrew-wk-steev-mike/franchises/columns/sounding-board/
Jesus Christ that was some read.
If we're going down that route then I think this is my favourite one
https://garysolonely.neocities.org/is-it-too-real-for-ya.html
Quote from: Yung Led Zeppelin on July 13, 2020, 01:08:17 PM
If we're going down that route then I think this is my favourite one
https://garysolonely.neocities.org/is-it-too-real-for-ya.html
Lol I read this one a while back, class stuff
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Here yiz go, lads
http://bravewords.com/news/did-the-cia-write-scorpions-hit-wind-of-change-new-podcast-series-investigates-secret-history-of-cold-war-espionage-and-heavy-metal
Quote from: Juggz on July 14, 2020, 07:58:16 PM
Here yiz go, lads
http://bravewords.com/news/did-the-cia-write-scorpions-hit-wind-of-change-new-podcast-series-investigates-secret-history-of-cold-war-espionage-and-heavy-metal
This sounds like good craic. Must try an ep after the soccer.
Have to be honest when I started this thread I was hoping for more stuff like this rather than the moon landings and whatnot. Don't get me wrong I still think that stuff is good but unless something new comes around, it's been done to death.
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https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-53416247
"the cabinets were "all listed with girls' names," prompting followers to allege that the pieces of furniture actually had children hidden in them as part of a supposed child trafficking ring."
:laugh: :laugh:
Americans who believe that masks are killing people: https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=3544563988967033&id=341163402640457
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Just came across this, and I need to know more, conspiracy theories around music are particularly entertaining
https://www.theguardian.com/music/2013/oct/03/kevin-shields-britpop-pushed-by-government
Yeah I'd like to see what he is on about there in more detail as well. I'm guessing that he is alluding to some of the stars of Britpop being used to garner political support for Labour or something along those lines but of course that is a shot in the dark unless there is more to find out about it.
On the general conspiracy topic, I watched the Epstein thing on Netflix the other night. There is some ridiculous cover up going on there. I wonder how high up that one goes.
(https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/04/13/16/2786E42F00000578-3037093-image-m-91_1428937892487.jpg)
He looks like a happy go lucky sort of chap. Definitely not a deviant of any description.
Came across this one on facebook (source of all truth and justice in the world and definitely never a source of misinformation!) It's a long one but it says fact check it if anyone wants to pick holes in it. I haven't fact checked it, just read it is all. Is any of it true does anyone think?
QuoteFACT CHECK IT!!!!!!!!!!! 🤬🤬🤬
STILL A CONSPIRACY? 👁
▪️Prince Harry and Megan leave the royal family.
(I would too if I found out my own family had my mother killed, and were satan worshipping, child traffickers)
▪️Prince Andrew is accused for pedophilia and was extremely close with Jeffrey Epstein.
(A convicted pedophile)
Research Epstein Island, Lolita express
(if you have a strong stomach)
▪️Research Pizzagate
(if you can handle it)
▪️Wiki leaks exposed Hillary Clinton for being a child sex trafficker (along with Obama, Podesta and many other people in power) and she conveniently deletes over 300,000 emails, and destroys a laptop and mobile phone she used while in office... and gets away with it??
▪️Ellen cancels her show; busted buying from a pedophile ring masquerading as a furrniture outlet where the purchases as children ( $10,000 for a 'pillow')
▪️Harvey Weinstein, Hollywood's biggest germ was finally arrested for sex crimes (another elite pedo) .. all of a sudden he gets the "virus"...?
▪️Prince Charles & now also the Queen conveniently have the "virus", yet the queen fled the palace to self isolate weeks ago...?
▪️All of your Hollywood favourites have the virus. Adrenochrome is your topic here, research it.
▪️Bill gates is pushing vaccines and global depopulation, and he conveniently owns 15% of the WHO (World Health Organisation). Yes, the WHO is a business, go figure. Which is also owned by George Soros and the Rockerfellers. Don't know them? Research them. (This information alone should make your stomach churn).
▪️Google is currently uncensored and you can access this information. (Why now?)
Whilst you're there, keep googling "Adrenochrome" and start to follow the trail...
▪️An Adrenochrome batch was made in Wuhan... how fitting...?
(Connecting the dots yet?)
▪️US has deployed 30,000 troops to Europe. "for training". Without masks or any hand sanitizer...
Interesting..
▪️600 Mexican drug cartels have recently been arrested, one of the biggest busts in history by the U.S... why didn't we hear about that?
Trump openly speaks about this more and more in his daily press releases as the days roll on, speaking about winning the 'war, and barely mentioning the actual virus in his 'Coronavirus' briefings.
▪️ 298 Saudi's royals, billionaires, lawyers and judges were recently arrested for crimes and corruption.
▪️3 Chinese including 1 Harvard professor were prosecuted for economic espionage a few weeks ago.. which is all extremely relevant to Wuhan, Covid-19 and everything that's going on right now. Research this.
▪️Trump crashed the Fed bank, they bought all of the gold and now hold the keys to creating a gold back currency, removing the fiat. The fed and treasury were basically merged meaning that Trump is now the Chairman for the global banking system with the people's money. Not the rothschilds, Rockerfellers, Soros, Goldman the list goes on.. this is HISTORIC.
▪️For this to be possible, the economy must be crashed. All corrupt coin needs to be drained. A 14-28 day lock down is the best way to do this and even better way to re-distribute the money back to people on government grants, payg refunds for business and ato offsets.. making sense yet? No longer will 99% of the worlds wealth be owned by an evil, greedy and corrupt 1%.
Believe what you want. Take what I say with a grain of salt... but open your eyes beyond the virus... and gosh.. just do some research! It's all happening.
▪️Dozens of the worlds most powerful CEO's have stood down.. why? Disney, Microsoft, Groupon and over 1300 of the top CEO's.. gone. This was before the crash mind you... what are they running from???
▪️ Thousands of arrests have been made for child trafficking, human trafficking and sex abuse.. but the media is not telling you that... what are they hiding? Nurses are coming forward speaking publicly about the fact they're treating hundreds of children in hospitals right now.. not for Coronavirus but for malnutrition, some extremely deformed, and all with extreme psychiatric damage due to trauma.
▪️ It's widely known there are underground tunnel systems (research D.U.M.B ) that have been used for decades to traffick people for sex slaves and organ harvesting, across the globe. There is currently a monumental military operation going down, lead by POTUS to uncover these children, arrest those involved, and stop this evil once and for all.
What you are seeing is a war. An invisible war that Trump keeps taking about...
It's a war between Trump "The Alliance" and the elites, bankers and mainstream media.
The alliance is a compilation of ppl who have been wirhing the government and slate sick of the bullshit
What your seeing is a war between good and evil.
Pay attention to the bigger picture. Trump has arrested and caught more pedophile and child trafficking rings in the world... but I bet you didn't know that because the mainstream (George Soros funded media) make out that he's a moron...
Trump will go down in history in the coming weeks.
There is no need to panic or have fear. This whole thing is working out as it needs to for Trump and his team to remove the corruption and power that has taxed your hard earned dollars, loaded your loans and credit cards with interest and pulled wool over your eyes.. we have been living as slaves to the system for long enough.
You're going to see some big names get called out, to the point where you don't want to believe it.
Oprah.
Ellen.
Obama.
Gates.
Clintons.
Podesta.
Hanks.
Madonna.
Gaga.
The list goes on and on and on.
If you still believe that 9/11 was a terrorist attack from Osama Bin Ladin who trained donkeys to fly cessnas, which then magically upskilled into Boeing's and flew aluminium planes into 580m steel reinforced towers that collapsed like a deck of cards, not to mention tower 7 which was a block away but folded. (Let's not forget the 6 seals who took Osama down that were killed in a mysterious chopper crash. RIP fellas).... you're in for a wake up call...
Some of the big banks WILL go bankrupt, they are already on their knees, Income tax WILL go away and the elites will no longer rule you or the world.
Welcome to the New World Order....
🙏🏼
Don't believe me? Do the research for yourself.
Personally I would read the Clinton emails on Wikileaks. Once you read that you'll believe the rest. Many of the most powerful people are more sick and evil than you could ever imagine. 👹🤡👺
Start listening to Trump's daily press briefings. This is not about politics. Read between the lines.
P.S. If you Thought the 5G conspiracies were crazy... stay tuned
Edit: And here is the more rational sounding take on this idea: https://thespinoff.co.nz/society/17-03-2020/emily-writes-down-the-rabbit-hole-with-the-covid-19-conspiracy-theorists/
Fuck. If it says fact check it then it must be all true. Imagine being so confident that you'd invite someone to fact check it. Line 4, the British royal family are Satan worshippers. Consider me convinced!
Yeah I stopped reading after the Satan Worshipping...
No fkn way am I reading anything that long :laugh:
Quote from: Juggz on August 13, 2020, 09:04:56 PM
Fuck. If it says fact check it then it must be all true. Imagine being so confident that you'd invite someone to fact check it. Line 4, the British royal family are Satan worshippers. Consider me convinced!
Liz always struck me as a satin worshiper for sure.
Yeah there are some great ones in there. FACT CHECK IT!!!
lol the last line was the final straw to convince me it's all true
I really hate people who post shit and say "do the research!!!111". No you fucking dumbass I wont because you said it so YOU have to provide the evidence.
The official FBI Records Vault caused a stir yesterday, tweeting out a copy of the Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion:
https://twitter.com/FBIRecordsVault/status/1296144912497352705
Our buddy Bezmenov makes an appearance in the new Call of Duty:
https://twitter.com/IGN/status/1296190451100213248
Well if ever there was a day for a few theories, it must be the anniversary of the WTC demolition.
So I think it was either a fix, or allowed to happen for strategic reasons.
Anyone?
Nah, they did it the bollixes.
Wasn't Kahlid Mohammed the chief architect of the whole thing? Same dude that was behind the Bojinka plot? And his co-conspirator was one of the guys behind the WTC bombings in 1993?
Considering one had a hard on for hijacking and blowing up aircraft and the other lad wanted to demolish the WTC buildings, I don't see much of a conspiracy.
I can't comment one way or another about the WTC7 building as I don't know enough about it.
The lads with the couple of hours flight training in the cessna or some shit? thank fuck the passport survived the demolition so we could all remember his name
It's like the Trump and Biden assault nonsense. There's no way to keep these things quiet. We've been watching too many movies. They did it and they completely changed the world as a result. I was in the Twin Towers a week before. Went back a year later. The country had bern turned on its head. Fucked up the whole thing.
The pentagon and the tower 7 shit is very dicey. Was looking at a description of the manoeuvre required for the pentagon hit and it's staggering the level of skill involved. Luckily enough the plane hit the very wing that was being redecorated though so at least no one important was hurt.
Quote from: Pedrito on September 12, 2020, 12:30:41 AM
I was in the Twin Towers a week before.
So was I. I remember being so disappointed that the queue for the Empire state building was too big so we had to settle for the Twin Towers of course now I am glad I got to see them.
Quote from: astfgyl on September 11, 2020, 08:00:12 PM
Well if ever there was a day for a few theories, it must be the anniversary of the WTC demolition.
So I think it was either a fix, or allowed to happen for strategic reasons.
Anyone?
I would not put it past elements of the US Government to allow it to happen, but still i think the truth always has a habit of emerging. In such a vast conspiracy some one would break rank and spill the beans. It is still hard to believe it could happen, but humans can be incompetence, also they are egoistical - with the latter in mind, US intelligence and security agencies were not in the habit of sharing information so it's not that difficult to see how information that might have led to the attack being foiled was missed.
Yeah to be fair I am surprised that nothing has come out from anyone on the inside as of yet. It has been almost 20 years. Still no explanation as to why Building 7 was demolished though, or how anyone had the foresight to rig it for collapse. Of course that is only one view, and there is another that says it went on fire due to the collapse of Buildings 1 and 2 and fell down by itself.
Also several elements of the Pentagon being hit by a plane are dubious from a piloting skill point of view.
Then there is the outcome, which led the U.S. to two wars in Iraq and Afghanistan but not Saudi Arabia, where the hijackers came from.
It's sort of a case of lots of things not adding up right, but I will certainly concede there is no actual concrete proof that it was an inside job, and it does seem unlikely that none has come out in two decades. I lean more towards it being known and let happen or something along those lines, but then the likes of Operation Northwoods shows that the U.S. had at least looked into the possibility of orchestrating an attack on their own soil and blaming it on another country https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Northwoods, so I don't think it beyond the realms of possibility that the U.S. would carry out such an operation on their own citizens.
Quote from: astfgyl on September 13, 2020, 09:26:43 AM
Yeah to be fair I am surprised that nothing has come out from anyone on the inside as of yet. It has been almost 20 years.
I don't think it's that surprising the majority of people think JFK was an inside job and nothing has really come out about that. If they can kill one of the few good presidents the US has ever had then I think anything is possible. Wasn't it the CIA that coined the term conspiracy theory in order to dismiss anyone who strays from the narrative as a lunatic. It has been working well for them so far.
Quote from: mickO))) on September 13, 2020, 11:52:09 AM
Wasn't it the CIA that coined the term conspiracy theory in order to dismiss anyone who strays from the narrative as a lunatic. It has been working well for them so far.
No it was around about 100 years before the CIA was even formed...unless they forged all the older documents containing the phrase to throw people off...
I dunno who coined the term, but I do know it is widely used to brush things off which may otherwise cause people to think a bit harder. Then again, if I have a theory that says the wtc was a bit dicey and it would have to involve a lot of folks conspiring to make it happen, I can hardly complain if someone paints it as a conspiracy theory.
Yeah but the problem is the term is associated with paid for shills like David Icke and Alex Jones who intentionally push crazy conspiracies along with the plausible ones to make most people dismiss anything they discuss.
Yeah agreed. That is the issue I have with it, too. Like if I think we are being conned on a worldwide scale right now for example, then I must also think that the earth is flat.
Enjoyed this, the voice is great.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXnQoFeVQII&ab_channel=Snordster
Fuck, if I apply that litmus test, I'll have no one left to talk to!
Quote from: astfgyl on September 13, 2020, 09:26:43 AM
Yeah to be fair I am surprised that nothing has come out from anyone on the inside as of yet. It has been almost 20 years. Still no explanation as to why Building 7 was demolished though, or how anyone had the foresight to rig it for collapse. Of course that is only one view, and there is another that says it went on fire due to the collapse of Buildings 1 and 2 and fell down by itself.
Also several elements of the Pentagon being hit by a plane are dubious from a piloting skill point of view.
Then there is the outcome, which led the U.S. to two wars in Iraq and Afghanistan but not Saudi Arabia, where the hijackers came from.
It's sort of a case of lots of things not adding up right, but I will certainly concede there is no actual concrete proof that it was an inside job, and it does seem unlikely that none has come out in two decades. I lean more towards it being known and let happen or something along those lines, but then the likes of Operation Northwoods shows that the U.S. had at least looked into the possibility of orchestrating an attack on their own soil and blaming it on another country https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Northwoods, so I don't think it beyond the realms of possibility that the U.S. would carry out such an operation on their own citizens.
There is also The Project for a New American Century document to consider. This document called for a Cataclysmic event to gear public opinion towards supporting foreign wars.
One of its chief architects was Richard Perle, who seemed to be on every channel in the lead up to Iraq War advocating for the war. I certainly would not past it some in the US would to have no qualms with allowing the attacks to happen to further their geo- political aims.
Quote from that Project thing:
QuoteIn September 2000 PNAC released "Rebuilding America's Defenses" a report that promotes "the belief that America should seek to preserve and extend its position of global leadership by maintaining the preeminence of U.S. military forces." The report also states, "advanced forms of biological warfare that can "target" specific genotypes may transform biological warfare from the realm of terror to a politically useful tool." [22] [23] [24]
Maybe this point has been addressed within the conspiracy bubble, but if it was an inside job, then why didn't they put people/passports on the planes that were Afghani and Iraqi rather than having everyone pretty quickly find out (via Michael Moore, for example) that the strongest connection was actually Saudi?
It seems some conspiratorial circles come to the conclusion that the attacks were orchestrated by Israel (dancing Isreali's etc), and I've also read that the Saudi Royal family are actually Donmeh, so some connection there could potentially answer that.
I've not looked into it enough to provide anything more than conjecture though.
Well, not really, because then you have to kind of dance between several different narratives in order for it to make sense. Passports were planted, yes or no? Passports were manipulated, yes or no? Attacks were US orchestrated inside job in order to garner domestic support for increased US military intervention, yes or no? But in that case, why use Saudis and/or why plant Saudi passports? And so on and so forth. Obviously I can't deal with every possible conspiracy theory in one go, I'm only talking about the supposed "inside job" one. Or maybe the powers that be were relying on the general ignorance of a large part of the US population to just say "NUKE THE WHOLE FUCKIN' MIDDLE EAST!", which is essentially what many of them said, meaning that it didn't matter which specific country the passports were from as long as they were countries associated with sand and the photos were of lads with towels on their heads.
Yeah it's quite the web.
I'd lean towards the passport that was found being planted, considering it's condition, it just seems mental that they found one completely undamaged coming out of those fireballs.
What manipulation took place with regards to passports? I'm not exactly well read up on the whole thing, just dipped in an out a bit over the years.
Saudi's, if they are in fact crypto-Jews, would allow Israel, if they are the perpetrators, to control the narrative would be a guess. If you accuse an innocent party, perhaps the multitude of things that could go wrong is too great a risk to take, instead accuse a country within your control to mitigate these. Who knows though.
And yeah you could be right, I'd say the average Americans knowledge of the Middle East is quite minimal, so as long as the perpetrators fitted a certain image, it probably didn't matter.
"Saudis, if they are in fact crypto-Jews"
That is a colossal "if". Saudi Arabia, home of both Mecca and possibly the world's most repressive Muslim legal and penal systems; all just over-compensating to better hide the charade? Surely, if "Saudis" are crypto-Jews, then in effect the entire Muslim religion are crypto-Jews, which sounds awfully like something someone who just wanted to embrace ALL semites in one handy envelope to be burnt might come up with. Anyway, I'm not getting into that; just pointing out that all the possible conspiracies conflict with each other just as much as they do with the official narrative, whether that be in its wholly naïve or harshly skeptical variants.
Yeah for sure, though colossal "Ifs" should find themselves a home in, of all places, a conspiracy theory thread.
It's been ages since I looked into it, but this might have been one of the articles I read before, pinch of salt and all that:
https://www.timesheadline.com/middle-east/the-house-of-saud-its-jewish-origin-and-installation-by-the-british-crown-42667.html
And also Sabbati Zevi converting to Islam, and the idea of Donmeh, crypto-Jews, is well known:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D%C3%B6nmeh#:~:text=The%20D%C3%B6nmeh%20(Turkish%3A%20D%C3%B6nme%2C,movement%20was%20centered%20in%20Thessaloniki.
So there's an avenue where it could make sense, but certainly, a big "If" nonetheless.
Humans seem to find a need to elaborate things to almost mystical levels constantly. Be it the traditional martial arts, religion, certain styles of metal etc etc. Deep, impenetrable ideas and concepts that only the few with the knowledge can truly understand. I went down that Donmeh rabbit hole about 6 months ago. The depths and intricacies of the conspiracy are so neatly and beautifully mapped out. But humans are not neat and they also don't know when to shut their mouths. It's nonsense pure and simple.
I'll keep mine open, regardless.
Nuke the middle east sounds about right. There is another option as well, that maybe the U.S. hadn't a clue who did it or why and simply invented evidence to appease the crowd. Unlikely sounding, but then every aspect of the whole thing is unlikely sounding.
Quote from: astfgyl on September 14, 2020, 03:10:04 PM
There is another option as well, that maybe the U.S. hadn't a clue who did it or why and simply invented evidence to appease the crowd. Unlikely sounding
Unlikely sounding? It's remarkably close to what most non-conspiracy theory yet US-skeptic people would believe: that they did know who did it and why, but they still simply invented evidence and argumentation in order to sell the people a war in Afghanistan, an then a later one in Iraq, with a few invented WMD sprinkled into the mix for good measure, the real motivations for which were something else entirely.
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on September 14, 2020, 03:18:09 PM
Quote from: astfgyl on September 14, 2020, 03:10:04 PM
There is another option as well, that maybe the U.S. hadn't a clue who did it or why and simply invented evidence to appease the crowd. Unlikely sounding
Unlikely sounding? It's remarkably close to what most non-conspiracy theory yet US-skeptic people would believe: that they did know who did it and why, but they still simply invented evidence and argumentation in order to sell the people a war in Afghanistan, an then a later one in Iraq, with a few invented WMD sprinkled into the mix for good measure, the real motivations for which were something else entirely.
That seems like a pretty reasonable explanation for a lot of it, sort of like they let it happen for strategic reasons but without the part of them knowing in advance. I think no idea is fully off the table with the whole thing anyway because there are so many contestable points.
You drive planes into the heart of America there has to be a response and it doesn't matter who suffers as long as there is a response. We would think the exact same. Definitely not saying it's right, but reason goes out the window when people feel under attack.
And the US exists, actually thrives, on a perpetual feeling of being under attack.
Well out of it all, some things we can be almost sure of are that it wasn't the Afghans or the Iraqis that did it, and yet the U.S. ended up invading both, with the public support they needed beautifully drummed up by the 9/11 attacks. Everything else is up in the air as to what exactly went down. There was some sort of inquiry into Saudi involvement back a few years but that seems to have come to nothing.
Re: Juggz. Really? It certainly didn't pre 9/11 anyway. Not in the way an Austrian or Ukranian might feel about Russia for example. I think the response was so extreme because they felt the opposite way, that they would never be attacked, or that it was so unlikely. There was massive incredulity at the time and it pushed the need to respond with an iron fist. They dropped the bomb on the Japanese who had attacked them on their own soil, the response had to be similar.
Some info on the aforementioned dancing Israeli's thing:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sev1CHZgz1g&ab_channel=CaesarCicerosErbe
Quote from: Pedrito on September 14, 2020, 03:45:58 PM
Re: Juggz. Really? It certainly didn't pre 9/11 anyway. Not in the way an Austrian or Ukranian might feel about Russia for example. I think the response was so extreme because they felt the opposite way, that they would never be attacked, or that it was so unlikely. There was massive incredulity at the time and it pushed the need to respond with an iron fist. They dropped the bomb on the Japanese who had attacked them on their own soil, the response had to be similar.
Nobody remembers when communists (real ones, not the plastic ones ye shriek about now 😉) were the problem?
The US didn't drop the atomic bomb on Japan as revenge for Pearl Harbour. The weapon was intended for use in Germany, to end the war in Europe, but wasn't ready in time. After the losses in the Pacific theatre, both military and civilian, and particularly after the invasion of Okinawa where civilian mortality rates were almost one in three, the invasion of mainland Japan, where one might rightly have expected increased defensive fanaticism, was expected to be an unmerciful bloodbath. Despite defeat being inevitable, the Japanese refused to surrender and tried to leverage the Soviet Union to sue for peace. The US dropped the bombs to prevent prolonging the war and as a means to avoid additional deaths, ironically enough, (mainly US military ones of course but civilian ones were also a factor) shocking Japan into surrender. They had already firebombed many Japanese cities into ashes, it wasn't as if they needed to draw blood to get revenge, they had being doing that for quite a while already. The firebombing of Tokyo in May killed more people than the atomic bomb dropped on Nagasaki in August and almost as many as the Hiroshima bomb. They had their revenge, multiple times over, before the atomic bomb was ever a viable weapon.
But I do agree that, overall, if the US decides it wants to draw blood somewhere, it usually finds a justification one way or the other. I am genuinely surprised they didn't go into Iran when Bolton was making overtures last year.
Would they have dropped a bomb on a country that hadn't attacked them on their own soil is really what I was saying(I was being lazy writing that initial point). I'm not so sure the US is always looking to go to war despite the narrative that is pushed. They flexed their muscle during the cold war thankfully for the rest of us. In terms of Iran, I don't see why they would ever want to get involved in a war there. It would never end and more than likely spark some sort of world war.
If Hillary had of won they would have ended up in a war with NK or Iran or maybe even both. All the giving out people do about Trump he's the only president in recent times that hasn't waged war on another country.
Quote from: Pedrito on September 14, 2020, 04:59:38 PM
Would they have dropped a bomb on a country that hadn't attacked them on their own soil is really what I was saying(I was being lazy writing that initial point). I'm not so sure the US is always looking to go to war despite the narrative that is pushed. They flexed their muscle during the cold war thankfully for the rest of us. In terms of Iran, I don't see why they would ever want to get involved in a war there. It would never end and more than likely spark some sort of world war.
Yes, they were going to drop it on Germany had it been ready in time. It's not just Iraq and Afghanistan, they invaded Libya too, none of whom were directly involved with 9/11. People forget we were all friends with Ghadaffi in the mid-2000s, that snake Blair even visited him, before it was decided he was a bad guy again. There is the narrative, of course, that they tend to stick their beak into oil generating countries. Didn't Maduro say he caught a US spy near a refinery last week? Do we believe him?
A lot of the US economic strength is based on weapon sales, both domestic and international. They have a vested interest in perpetual conflict or, alternatively, unrest. The amount of public money they spend militarily is fucking staggering.
Quote from: Pedrito on September 14, 2020, 02:43:56 PM
Humans seem to find a need to elaborate things to almost mystical levels constantly. Be it the traditional martial arts, religion, certain styles of metal etc etc. Deep, impenetrable ideas and concepts that only the few with the knowledge can truly understand. I went down that Donmeh rabbit hole about 6 months ago. The depths and intricacies of the conspiracy are so neatly and beautifully mapped out. But humans are not neat and they also don't know when to shut their mouths. It's nonsense pure and simple.
I agree to an extent regarding why some people ascribe events to conspiracies, However there are also people who don't want to believe that those they identify with in terms of values and political ideology are capable of carring out such things. Operation Northwood and various other clandestine plots show they clearly are.
Regarding the incompetence narrative, Mossad back in the 60s when asked what had they learned from a foiled false flag op in Egypt, said: "to ensure we don't get caught next time" With this in mind, while these security services do eff up, they are more than capable of executing plots successfully, none more so than the Israelis.
If the attacks on September 2001 were allowed to happen, this might explain why it was only Saudi passports that were found. However a flaw in the it was allowed to happen angle is how could those who had knowledge of it ensure that other government agencies did not get whiff of it and expose it.
So all in all I do lean towards it not being an inside job
Quote from: Juggz on September 14, 2020, 04:29:57 PM
But I do agree that, overall, if the US decides it wants to draw blood somewhere, it usually finds a justification one way or the other. I am genuinely surprised they didn't go into Iran when Bolton was making overtures last year.
If Hillary was in power they likely would have. Donald does not seem to be pro- war. He ignored Bolton, who has never seen war he did not like. He is one of the few US presidents that has not started a war. I give him credit for that.
Quote from: Juggz on September 14, 2020, 04:23:58 PM
Quote from: Pedrito on September 14, 2020, 03:45:58 PM
Re: Juggz. Really? It certainly didn't pre 9/11 anyway. Not in the way an Austrian or Ukranian might feel about Russia for example. I think the response was so extreme because they felt the opposite way, that they would never be attacked, or that it was so unlikely. There was massive incredulity at the time and it pushed the need to respond with an iron fist. They dropped the bomb on the Japanese who had attacked them on their own soil, the response had to be similar.
Nobody remembers when communists (real ones, not the plastic ones ye shriek about now 😉) were the problem?
Just coming back on that little dig..sneaky. It's funny, I'm probably as liberal as it comes but when one decides not to buy into every narrative going out there it's interesting the accusations thrown at them not just by you Juggz but in a wider sense. But I'm a big boy, I can take it.
BUT, just in case it wasn't already clear enough, it's not me who is saying that X, Y and Z come from a particular mould. They're saying it themselves and it's hardly new news. Straight from the horses mouth:
https://nypost.com/2020/06/25/blm-co-founder-describes-herself-as-trained-marxist/
Now, do I actually believe they want Communism? Not on your nelly. One look at that well fed beefcake in the article and you can see she'd fall.to pieces without her regular skinny lattes and trips to Maccie D's. But certainly the tactics they are using and the ideology is deeply rooted:
It also expresses its appreciation for the work of the US Communist Party, "especially Black communists," as well as its support for "the great work of the Black Panther Party, the American Indian Movement, Young Lords, Brown Berets, and the great revolutionary rainbow experiments of the 1970s,"
So, as far as I'm concerned, fascism is equally as repugnant as Communism or Marxism or Trotskyism. They can all go away and fuck and leave us to our albeit corrupt and out of date and certainly flawed democracy.
This is a decent breakdown of what is happening with BLM vs 'Black Lives Matter'. Essentially 2 completely different conversations are taking place with a lot of people simply not understanding a deeper context to the thing. Whatever, I'm all BLM, Covided out right now couldn't care less tbh.
https://fee.org/articles/is-black-lives-matter-marxist-no-and-yes/
The history of the CPUSA is pretty fascinating stuff, worth a look into. On the ground, and despite their many, many faults, they were definitely doing more for the black community than anyone else at a certain important time in history, so the fact that there are still sympathies and more today is not surprising at all. There are a couple of good documentaries which look at its history from the grassroots level up, before, during, and after the mass disillusionment with Stalin:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-Y4tEFnI38
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nhmGVnHxtf0
The notion that "Marxism" is synonymous with "Anti-Americanism" is a nonsense conflation, by the by. But then the nature of the fight against communists in the USA, as in US citizens who were members of the CPUSA, reveals that if we judge their opponents by their actions and words, then if "Communism" is "Anti-Americanism" then whatever "pro-Americanism" is, it's certainly not democracy.
In fairness it was the 40's and 50's and when we look at the track record of the Communist countries before and after, it could easily be argued that it required a less than democratic approach. Stalin bettwen 6 and 20 million murdered. Mao: the great leap forward: 45 million. Then you other little squabbles like Cambodia. I went there a decade ago. There was one architect and no engineer left after they finished murdering half of their population. The killing fields where they used to smash the babies heads instead of using bullets left quite the impression. They picked them up by the legs and swung them..and the taxi driver was one of them. They're all still alive the lads that did it. Horrible.
As I said, and is generally accepted fact, there was an enormous, almost generalized abandonment of the CPUSA once Stalin's true nature came to light. Meaning? Meaning that the ideals of communism to which members of the CPUSA had signed up were seen as incommensurable with his actions. Same applies to Mao, same applies to Cambodia. I mean, I'm as much a critic of economic liberalism as you seem to be of communism, but I don't argue against it by harping on about Pinochet every time the subject comes up.
Any sentence which begins with...
Quote from: mickO))) on September 14, 2020, 05:02:44 PM
If Hillary had of won they would have
usually has some kind of fantasy pulled from the pages of the Guns 'n' Ammo "Reader's Letters" section...
Quote from: mickO))) on September 14, 2020, 05:02:44 PMended up in a war with NK or Iran or maybe even both. All the giving out people do about Trump he's the only president in recent times that hasn't waged war on another country.
And there it is :laugh:
I don't think anyone is going to war with NK without China's approval. No sane US president will think that China will welcome US troops waging war on their border, so I would count that as pure fantasy. Iran, it's plausible, there's a definite move to get them before they get the bomb, but I don't see why it would be Hillary and not Donald. If you have any documentation supporting that it would be interesting to read.
As for the US not waging war under Trump, this might be an eye-opener. Although, it's called "combatting terrorism" here, not waging war :laugh:
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/map-shows-places-world-where-us-military-operates-180970997/
QuoteThis map is the most comprehensive depiction in civilian circles of U.S. military and government antiterrorist actions overseas in the past two years.
Published in 2019, so this shows where they have been active since 2017.
Back to the point, since the end of WWII the US has always had an enemy they keep in public consciousness. Nothing has changed.
It took you 15 hours to come up with that :laugh:
Yes, I stayed up all night.
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on September 15, 2020, 12:01:43 AM
As I said, and is generally accepted fact, there was an enormous, almost generalized abandonment of the CPUSA once Stalin's true nature came to light. Meaning? Meaning that the ideals of communism to which members of the CPUSA had signed up were seen as incommensurable with his actions. Same applies to Mao, same applies to Cambodia. I mean, I'm as much a critic of economic liberalism as you seem to be of communism, but I don't argue against it by harping on about Pinochet every time the subject comes up.
Eeehhh yes you do. I'd be equally wary of economic liberalism myself. Of course there were very meaningful ideas that came out of Communism but the end results cannot be argued with. You read the likes of Steinbeck and you'd need to be deaf dumb and blind not to realise that classism and a lack of protection for workers, rights etc etc were not necessary. There is a whole dark side to it all that seems obsessed with manipulation and control however that I would be extremely wary of,that's all. I'm saying nothing new, I just find it interesting how the tactics of old have been reborn again in the modern age. A bit like the Jesuits 'Give me the child and I'll show you the man' I'm wary of any of these all encompassing approaches, be they neo-liberalism, fascism, communism, whatever, and certainly anyone who has had spent more than half an hour in the company of former Blackrock college pupils would agree :P
Listen, the 1917 October Revolution was some of the greatest horseplay of all time!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7navJmVRWk
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on September 15, 2020, 11:49:48 AM
Listen, the 1917 October Revolution was some of the greatest horseplay of all time!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7navJmVRWk
"They awl have to down some points of Chang"
:laugh:
Ireland is in safe hands.... :abbath:
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on September 15, 2020, 11:49:48 AM
Listen, the 1917 October Revolution was some of the greatest horseplay of all time!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7navJmVRWk
Fucking hell :laugh: I'd say half them lads went straight for the ladyboys spots in Soi Cowboy. I laaav laydyboooys
https://www.spin.com/2016/12/conspiracy-king-alex-jones-might-have-a-side-career-as-an-acid-house-musician/?fbclid=IwAR0kgClEm4i4TcWvZzJDsGQjQ8FANUuAUHWfbLCWijkfyT8OZywIHbPosAI
Quote from: Yung Led Zeppelin on September 16, 2020, 07:44:10 PM
https://www.spin.com/2016/12/conspiracy-king-alex-jones-might-have-a-side-career-as-an-acid-house-musician/?fbclid=IwAR0kgClEm4i4TcWvZzJDsGQjQ8FANUuAUHWfbLCWijkfyT8OZywIHbPosAI
Lol, I bet his tunes make everyone feel paranoid and ruin the buzz
Moving over here from the Trump thread:
Quote from: Bigmac on October 10, 2020, 08:33:47 PM
Quote from: Cailleach on October 10, 2020, 01:37:54 PM
Also don't mention the FBI investigations that were stopped regarding their Allies activity on American soil
Fun fact: Some of the worlds most innovative dance comes from Israel. Google "Dancing Israelis" to find out more ;)
What is the consensus with those lads anyway or is it just total unknown stuff? Is the idea that they somehow collaborated with the US in making or allowing the thing to happen?
.
Quote from: Bigmac on October 11, 2020, 10:02:03 PM
I think I posted this here somewhere before, but it gives a general overview. There were loads of different resources when you searched for 'Dancing Israelis' when I first looked into it a while back, but I can't see them now.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sev1CHZgz1g&ab_channel=CaesarCicerosErbe
Another angle on our friend Yuri:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=niiF8hCSrYQ&t=188s&ab_channel=AcademicAgent
Quote from: astfgyl on October 11, 2020, 11:49:15 AM
Moving over here from the Trump thread:
Quote from: Bigmac on October 10, 2020, 08:33:47 PM
Quote from: Cailleach on October 10, 2020, 01:37:54 PM
Also don't mention the FBI investigations that were stopped regarding their Allies activity on American soil
Fun fact: Some of the worlds most innovative dance comes from Israel. Google "Dancing Israelis" to find out more ;)
What is the consensus with those lads anyway or is it just total unknown stuff? Is the idea that they somehow collaborated with the US in making or allowing the thing to happen?
The theory is that Mossad might not have passed on knowledge they had about it because they viewed the consequences of it as being advantageous to their geo- political aims. I'm not really convinced by this argument. What we do know is the FBI are kept busy by Mossad activity in the USA. As I mentioned previously, some of their investigations into these activities have been stopped due to political pressure.
A close family member sent me this today, without a shred of irony...
QuoteFather, hold back the forces of evil that are roaming freely in our world.
An open letter [to President Trump] from Archbishop Vigano about the ramping up of "a global conspiracy against God and humanity"
https://nw-connection.com/?p=7224
Saw that one doing the rounds last week.
So Trump is now god's emissary on earth. Happy days! Is the family member aware of your political/philosophical leanings by any chance?
Edit-nevermind, file is too big to attach.
Seeing as some of you were discussing Manufacturing Consent in another thread: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOUcXK_7d_c
Not sure whether to put this here or in the Gear forum :laugh:
https://www.guitarworld.com/news/conspiracy-theorists-share-schematic-for-5g-chip-they-claim-is-implanted-in-covid-19-vaccines-only-its-actually-for-the-boss-metal-zone
QuoteConspiracy theorists share schematic for "5G chip" they claim is implanted in COVID-19 vaccines – only it's actually for the Boss Metal Zone
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on January 05, 2021, 12:30:39 PM
Not sure whether to put this here or in the Gear forum :laugh:
https://www.guitarworld.com/news/conspiracy-theorists-share-schematic-for-5g-chip-they-claim-is-implanted-in-covid-19-vaccines-only-its-actually-for-the-boss-metal-zone
QuoteConspiracy theorists share schematic for "5G chip" they claim is implanted in COVID-19 vaccines – only it's actually for the Boss Metal Zone
I actually heard about this one yesterday it gave me a good laugh. Has to be trolling surely
Here is an interesting take on the current state of things. Watch it before it gets taken down again.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zzy7pKs8Ck
Stay out of the comments section
Quote from: astfgyl on January 09, 2021, 12:10:19 PM
Here is an interesting take on the current state of things. Watch it before it gets taken down again.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zzy7pKs8Ck
Stay out of the comments section
I was watching that a couple of weeks ago, I think she starts out well, but even as much as I love conspiratorial stuff, she lost me a bit and I tapped out after 20 minutes or so.
However, the fact that it was banned makes me want to watch it all now, so I'll give it another go later.
I must admit it took me more than one go to get through it. The interviewer could have questioned her a bit more, too. It actually gets more interesting around half way through when she gets on to the BLM riots and her take on it is not one I've encountered much
Quote from: astfgyl on January 09, 2021, 01:57:59 PM
I must admit it took me more than one go to get through it. The interviewer could have questioned her a bit more, too. It actually gets more interesting around half way through when she gets on to the BLM riots and her take on it is not one I've encountered much
Ah right, I never got that far, cheers.
Yeah that is interesting about the riots. I suppose we are taking her word for the locations, but if it's true, that's quite the correlation. Intriguing thoughts about the end of slavery too.
The thing that got me to turn it off in the first place was the whole injecting operating systems into us, so decided to poke around a bit. The video below from 2016 by the WEF states around the 10:00 mark that:
Quote''up until now, the conversation we've been having is about Freedom of Speech...once we can access people's thoughts and access people's emotions, we have to create a space that enables people to think freely, to think divergent thoughts, to think creative thoughts and in a society were people fear having those thoughts the likelihood of people being able to enjoy progress is significantly diminished''
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpW9JcWxKq0&t=481s&ab_channel=WorldEconomicForum
You'd imagine the way to gain access to our thoughts would be to introduce something into our bodies. Fuck knows.
I always cringed a bit when folks mention sterilizing populations too, but they were actually at that in Israel, so I suppose there is a precedent set:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/jan/30/forced-contraception-jewish-ethopian-women
There's books out there about banking, which might aid in the "Mr Global" understanding.
I suppose we can see if some sort of universal basic income is suggested somewhere in the not too distant future. I think I'm fairly happy with my self sufficiency direction these days. Even if I'm a bold boy and they cut off my income, I can remain bold.
That interviewer is so fucking awkward.
The interviewer is terrible. Some very interesting viewpoints in the video though and as you linked about the WEF up there, it isn't the greatest leap to what she is talking about, as ridiculous as it first seems. She nearly lost me there as well when I watched and I think had she left that part out a lot more people would be more interested in the rest of what she has to say
Strange justification for taking the original down too:
https://home.solari.com/planet-lockdown-interview/
Quote from: Bigmac on January 09, 2021, 07:09:54 PM
Strange justification for taking the original down too:
https://home.solari.com/planet-lockdown-interview/
Yeah they certainly use the fuzzy search when looking to remove content. I think they could simply update the terms to say toe the line or fuck off at this stage
https://www.pscp.tv/w/1yNxaWnnMZnGj
The video is legit. The theory is that this was the point of it all. Of course no one would believe a crazy thing like that even if it did happen to be going on right under their noses.
Welcome to the new world order normal. The good news is that it is permanent.
Dunno about the rest of you all, but I'm buzzing hard off this new normal and it bears no resemblance to anything like China, or 1930s Germany or stalin's russia. No, nothing going on at all. The comments give a rapid indicator of how fucked we are
https://mobile.twitter.com/GardaTraffic/status/1353654440113414144
Here fuck it have the whole page. Look how safe we are. Nothing like anything from history at all.
https://mobile.twitter.com/GardaTraffic
https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1336848784798703618.html
Here is a long and very detailed read for anyone who likes a good theory. A lot of it sounds plausible, although the origin story at the top didn't seem overly convincing.
Whoever wrote it certainly put a lot of work in.
Hard to know what thread to put some stuff in these days, but Russell Brand - who many of you enjoy - quoted heavily from this piece by Naomi Klein in recent videos, so thought it might be worth posting in full:
https://naomiklein.org/the-great-reset-conspiracy-smoothie/
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on February 01, 2021, 11:29:07 AM
Hard to know what thread to put some stuff in these days, but Russell Brand - who many of you enjoy - quoted heavily from this piece by Naomi Klein in recent videos, so thought it might be worth posting in full:
https://naomiklein.org/the-great-reset-conspiracy-smoothie/
Some good points in there and fair ones about conflating the 5G with it all. I don't disagree with her about 99% of it and I remain extremely suspicious about this rotten Great Reset. It's for the same reasons she mentions that I don't believe in any way that the types of corporate sponsors involved in this want anything good for me or for the planet in general unless it helps them line their own pockets. She makes a fine point about the smoothie though and how that deflects from the actual thing. Like saying covid was created for this is a bit much but thinking that it was exaggerated to bring on something like this doesn't seem to be too much of a stretch to me, given how quickly the WEF were on it.
For anyone who hasn't bothered yet, here is the website https://greatreset.com/
The conspiracy theory is that something like a pandemic was needed to further this agenda. The Naomi Klein article posted above addresses some of the conflation but seems to completely ignore the coincidences involved. Also worth bearing in mind that I'm posting this in his thread. For now.
Here's a pic from the site I grabbed from twitter that does nothing to dispel the rumours
https://twitter.com/lapogus1/status/1356340388752187399/photo/2
I honestly think this shit is permanent for the 99% that we all belong to. The private jet crowd will of course get a bye. That seems locked in as I see it. The highly debatable part is how much covid was used as the Trojan horse. Maybe a little, maybe a lot, maybe not.
Spotify is rigged:
https://youtu.be/whQ8UBoz-To
Interesting breakdown of things we all know happen with Spotify. Not entirely conspiracy but close enough. There is definitely more to the story, it is something I'll do a bit more digging on, plenty of interesting but dodgy facets to the story.
It's a 20 minute watch, the channel itself (Barely Sociable) is great too and he does a lot of this style of video, definitely worth a look in if you're after something to watch.
"Growth" as a metric of success was only ever going to lead to this kind of shite
Quote from: Yung Led Zeppelin on February 17, 2021, 10:33:15 AM
"Growth" as a metric of success was only ever going to lead to this kind of shite
Yup. There's absolutely heaps wrong with the whole system here, and what it is doing to music in general, but something that fascinates me about it is how the product being used here isn't even important in the transaction. Art commodified to the point of being utterly useless, the only things relevant are clicks and revenue. Even the lads running the phone farms, though a drop in the bucket compared to what labels are at, are even saying the content doesn't matter. Of course this also bleeds into actual creative attitudes, inadvertently, and you have artists genuinely trying to compete against a rigged system by flogging their music on the same platform, and designing music, releases, promotion around Spotify - totally pointless when it is just a click farm.
Anyone read this before? https://deagel.com/forecast
Came across it a while ago but forgot about it. The bit of reading at the bottom is an interesting scenario. The predictions for each country are based on I dunno what but are grim. Ireland predicted to have a population of 1.2 million by 2025 for some reason.
Very little official to be found about the purpose of this site but an interesting little rabbit hole for anyone who likes these sort of things
http://www.newsfocus.org/deagel.htm
https://www.weforum.org/people/leo-varadkar
Proponents of The Great Reset have our oul pal Leo featured on their website.
Then this: https://www.lobbying.ie/return/59469/q4pr
Our friend Leo lobbied by Bill Gates
Then this: https://www.weforum.org/organizations/world-health-organization-who
Great reset pushers in partnership with pandemic pushers
Then this: https://www.politico.eu/article/bill-gates-who-most-powerful-doctor/
Billy boy main donor of WHO
https://www.gavi.org/operating-model/gavis-partnership-model/bill-melinda-gates-foundation
Billy also founder of GAVI, vaccine alliance.
https://www.gavi.org/news/media-room/ireland-pledges-new-support-gavi
Varadkar pledges money to GAVI.
this shit could go on and on, but it's rather circular is it not?
Edit: It's in this thread because it's only a theory and there is no proof that these lads are conspiring to make a fuckload of money and control of the world's economies. It would be too obvious with it being all out in the open like that. If one wished to do their own bit of digging, pick any other country and search WEF, WHO and GAVI and also look at Wellcome Trust with the same thing in mind.
Edit 2: Wellcome Trust are funding or have funded every lockdown loving, vaccine pushing mofo in the news nowadays, if anyone hasn't heard of them.
What's that, bill gates again!! https://www.gatesfoundation.org/How-We-Work/Quick-Links/Grants-Database/Grants/2016/07/OPP1151904
Edit 3: Just googled "Luke O Neill Wellcome Trust" and here we go https://www.hrb.ie/news/news-story/article/new-frontiers-in-inflammation-research/
Wow, even our resident guitar playing lunatic who wants kids to take a vaccine to go to their debs is connected. I would call it an octopus but it has too many limbs for that
Tell Bugs Bunny I was asking for him while you're down there... :laugh:
Quote from: Kurt Cocaine on March 09, 2021, 08:50:16 PM
Tell Bugs Bunny I was asking for him while you're down there... :laugh:
:laugh: :laugh:
It's in this thread for a reason!
Quote from: astfgyl on March 09, 2021, 09:03:24 PM
Quote from: Kurt Cocaine on March 09, 2021, 08:50:16 PM
Tell Bugs Bunny I was asking for him while you're down there... :laugh:
:laugh: :laugh:
It's in this thread for a reason!
Sending you a hug brother ;D
I'll take it, sound man. Even the wife is sick to the teeth of me..
Quote from: astfgyl on March 09, 2021, 09:03:24 PM
Quote from: Kurt Cocaine on March 09, 2021, 08:50:16 PM
Tell Bugs Bunny I was asking for him while you're down there... :laugh:
:laugh: :laugh:
It's in this thread for a reason!
This channel goes down a bit of rabbit hole looking at Gates' past, and the wealth and elite connections he comes from.
Think it was last year I watched it, so can't remember if there's anything worthwhile in it. Think it mentions the Epstein connection anyway. Seems like something that would entertain you:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wuMkShZ42o&ab_channel=reallygraceful
To be fair, there are so many rabbit holes to go down when it comes to Bill Gates that it's nearly too easy. He has his fingers in every sort of thing and he is a shining example of why unfettered capitalism is a bad thing. He is currently buying up vast swathes of farmland in the US and telling the rest of us that we need to be eating synthetic meat and not driving our cars, while he pays for carbon credits to offset his own jet-setting lifestyle and the media hang on his every word simply because he is rich. Like that long post I put there last night took all of 5 minutes to research on google and make links between Leo Varadkar, the WEF and Bill Gates and the same could be done with almost any political leader or government scientific or health advisor in any country. Gates really is all over everything, directly or indirectly, especially through the WHO and Wellcome Trust and coincidentally, the policies pushed by those entities all allow for the rich to become even richer in the current situation. It isn't even really a conspiracy theory though, more it just is what it is and is there for anyone to see.
Nothing new in here for many of you, the historical info has featured in several documentaries, but always good for a timely reminder of why a virtual, capital based economy is necessarily detrimental to the well-being of a planet with real, finite resources and a massive pollution problem (it's about planned obsolescence):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5v8D-alAKE
Yeah because those planned economies were a real boon for Mother Nature!
No, you're wrong there; most of the times that's been tried, it turned into a disaster. Just like that one time capitalism was tried absolutely everywhere; ongoing disaster!
Good read from the ever engaging, regardless of which diverse topic he's treating, Jon Ronson, 20 years after release of his book Them: Adventures with Extremists:
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/apr/11/making-sense-of-conspiracy-theorists-as-the-world-gets-more-bizarre
Not a bad read that. It's a bit like the How We All Became Richard Nixon video that I posted in the random thread. As much as I laugh at the lizard demon crowd, he describes my own affliction very well in the last paragraph
Ok here's a new one. Bezos and Gates have manufactured their divorces as a way to be forced to sell their shares and split the money with the wives because they know the crash of the stock market is imminent. If they simply sell them, the price will crash and that's no good, and there are laws around doing that in the knowledge something is about to happen. But if a judge orders them to split their fortunes with the exes, they get a free pass on selling up, following a precedent set during the collapse of Enron back in the day where one chap got to sell up due to a divorce.
Pretty tenuous stuff but might be interesting
Not so much conspiracy but this should get things heated up in America
https://m.independent.ie/world-news/north-america/us-presidential-election-2020/american-man-admits-he-voted-for-trump-with-his-dead-mothers-name-i-listened-to-too-much-propaganda-40386803.html
Quote from: Doctor Crippen on May 04, 2021, 07:17:20 PM
Not so much conspiracy but this should get things heated up in America
https://m.independent.ie/world-news/north-america/us-presidential-election-2020/american-man-admits-he-voted-for-trump-with-his-dead-mothers-name-i-listened-to-too-much-propaganda-40386803.html
I've been keeping half an eye on the election audit in Maricopa County over the last week or so. I would be very very surprised if it didn't throw up bogus votes for both Biden and Trump, given how easy it seems to do with postal votes and no signature verification. The very fact that the election was stolen story is given such credence among republicans points to the fact that something might need to be fixed there. It will be an interesting outcome and Trump has started calling the whole thing The Big Lie which could be funny if his supporters were cheating.
https://unherd.com/thepost/long-live-the-tartarian-empire/
Here's one I haven't seen before, The Tartarian Empire. Edit: I should clarify the link isn't ancient stuff like I go on about in the next paragraph, I just got excited there was all. The Unherd article doesn't have a lot in it only mention of the idea but I found this explanation of the theory here https://www.stolenhistory.org/articles/tartary-aka-tartaria-an-empire-hidden-in-history-it-was-bigger-than-russia-once.5/ Have only heard of this last night so hopefully it's not instantly falsifiable with little to no effort. Where'd be the fun in that?
Of all the theories outside of the mainstream, the ancient builders stuff is my favourite. It's not even conspiracy theories about the ancient stuff, it's how amazing and unexplained it all is. The pyramids, the massive stone walls with homogenous designs in all parts of the world. It's not even a cover up story just loads of really interesting unknowns.
As Donald Rumsfeld once said
Quote...as we know, there are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns—the ones we don't know we don't know
Looks like the UFO's or whatever the new term is are getting a bit of attention in the US lately. Youtube has been shoving US news reports of such things my way since I watched Bob Lazar and they seem to be giving the whole UFO thing a bit of a platform on the national channels.
Also, watch out for misinformation. It's everywhere.
https://twitter.com/rte/status/1395297188931010560
"The language of conspiracy - A psychological analysis of speech used by conspiracy theorists and their followers on Twitter."
https://t.co/1k6pmq8GNG?amp=1
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on June 01, 2021, 09:44:45 AM
"The language of conspiracy - A psychological analysis of speech used by conspiracy theorists and their followers on Twitter."
https://t.co/1k6pmq8GNG?amp=1
Interested to read this later on, good to see a decent research on it. Had some twitter threads bookmarked from before, but since lost, that I'm trying to find again related to this. One in particular was about the path or radicalisation users follow on various social media platforms. It was a few years back, an American woman involved in cyber security had some posts up that were slating Trump and she drew the ire of a range of characters online. She picked a handful of the people attacking her and did a dive through any publicly available posts and info on them to identify patterns. Taking one user then as an example, she posted about where he started online - late 2000s, Facebook posts, nothing out of the ordinary - and followed his data through various likes, posts, comments on different topics where he turnes from an apparently happy, very regular guy, into someone who was permanently online sharing QAnon posts on various platforms and in the comments of everything he stood against on a vicious attack. She had found a lot of it started from liking local politics pages, then when these politicians began sharing right-leaning media, this guy would follow the pages and was then recommended more in line with that, which he interacts with and then causes the echo chamber like effect, over the course of about four years spiralling him into the poster she found in her comment sections. She goes into significantly more detail than I have. If I find it again I'll post it here.
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on June 01, 2021, 09:44:45 AM
"The language of conspiracy - A psychological analysis of speech used by conspiracy theorists and their followers on Twitter."
https://t.co/1k6pmq8GNG?amp=1
Presumably, whatever language that they are using, it's spelled wrong...
Found this a bit rambling myself, but interesting nonetheless, if nothing else then because of who wrote it:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jul/01/edward-snowdon-conspiracy-theories-belief-powerlessness
The core thing he starts off with is very Chomsky; why get caught up in conspiracy theories when, humanistically speaking at least, the things done in the open are as bad if not worse than the imagined things people put so much energy into trying to prove?
I'll have to get a look at that but I'd guess most people don't really believe most of the theories even as they read them. Like the moon landings for example. I don't believe the theories around that but I still like reading them. I see it as an extension of reading mysteries like Bigfoot and all that shit. Like there's lots of real conspiracies but I like reading the unbelievable stuff instead or the fun stuff like Andrew WK or the stuff that could possibly be real but 99 percent chance it isn't. Take The Weekly World News for example and there's probably people somewhere who think that shit was all real. Poor fuckers.
The Weekly World News was class.
https://weeklyworldnews.com/headlines/182087/blondie-song-rapture-predicted-alien-attack/
Here's one I spotted today
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E45jYnVWUAMODpe?format=png&name=900x900)
So I checked it
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolf_Heusinger
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_Waldheim
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wernher_von_Braun
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walter_Hallstein
Now to be fair, I don't know what conspiracy exactly this is supposed to be pointing out (that the EU/UN etc is an extension of Nazi Germany, I suppose) but it's a bit interesting to see how it all panned out for these lads
And here's another one https://www.dn.se/sverige/ewa-stenberg-nu-hanger-det-pa-annie-loof-igen/
And another from what seems like a proper source: https://www.businessinsider.com/military-government-secret-experiments-biological-chemical-weapons-2016-9?r=US&IR=T
Not really sure where to put this one, but it's barely been mentioned. There are countless articles in the new Pegasus dossier on the Guardian website, of more or less interest, but I guess this one of an interview with Snowden has the broadest appeal:
https://www.theguardian.com/news/2021/jul/19/edward-snowden-calls-spyware-trade-ban-pegasus-revelations
Of course I'd be the one to read it.
I'm really surprised that this seems like new news as I'd find it more shocking if it wasn't the case. I guess the future under potential constant surveillance will be one of constant self-censorship. I believe Snowden when he says there is no way to avoid things like this. John McAfee was another one saying something similar. I expect him to crop up more and more in the theories soon enough after the hanging but he said all the antivirus software had back doors built in, which is also wholly unsurprising. He also said he wouldn't hang himself, which will surely be the basis of most of the theories to come which involve him. Not much doing as of yet on that but I would imagine it would be Snowden type revelations if anything. I see why you were not sure where to put it though as it's proper news and not a theory as such but will have a lot of theorists saying told you so, or such like. Must read into some of the other ones on there.
Speaking of theories, here's a bit of an article about them that I encountered today: https://www.livescience.com/56479-americans-believe-conspiracy-theories.html
Headline says over half believe 9/11 theories. I am iffy about certain elements of it, bu of course it's again like reading the Bigfoot stories because it makes fuck all difference now anyway but is still fun to think about every now and again. So now I'm seemingly lumped in with the "white, employed Republican with a lower income, who is affiliated with a Christian denomination but doesn't attend religious services too often" contingent. Downer, but I suppose the minorities are too busy trying to feed themselves or avoid being shot to have time for this sort of stuff so there is that.
Think I might have found the best of them all. Have heard a similar version of this with the Free Man of The Land movement here in Ireland the last few years.
It's something along the lines of "Legally, you're already dead, and that being legally dead has legal implications for those who use a dead person's name" ..... https://pstramer.wordpress.com/2018/02/19/an-education-on-the-birth-certificate-from-frank-ocollins/
Can't imagine a practical situation to use it in either but I really hope somebody somewhere challenges a government on it for the craic. I'd love to hear the legal back-and-forth
A=440hz standard tuning
Looks like Alex Jones is in a bit of hot water. Must be a conspiracy against him to make him commit perjury.
I saw Owen Shroyer looking extremely shook giving his testimony and being called out by a judge for bullshitting and not keeping his mouth shut about the case.
Pity, he's an excellent thorn in the side of woke psychopaths.
High level moronics alright:
https://twitter.com/cathyrusson/status/1552805371282014209
He was very sheepish indeed. Considering his ultra brash, confrontational style of making his point when he's 'on air', it is jarring.
I lap this lad up, but he's not as clever as he thinks, clearly.
Funnily enough, I've no idea who he is but he got roasted nonetheless
For some reason Alex Jones' texts have now been turned over to the January 6th committee. I haven't followed the story much but if it involves Trump in any way I'm sure the patriots will be livid. Might head over to gab and check a few of the Q accounts. It's usually something along the lines of "Nothing can stop what is coming" etc etc but it's almost always hilarious
Anne Heche
She's the head of The Elite?
There's a conspiracy going around that the crew member shot by Alec Baldwin was working on a project about child abuse or human trafficking or something. Same conspiracy narrative says Anne Heche was too. And there was a video claiming to show Heche sitting up out of a body bag. Usual stuff.
She's definitely sitting up in that video. Other than that I dunno I haven't dug in at all I'm waiting for someone else to come up with the theories
Body bag? Are you talking about her on the stretcher when she was taken out of the car? She wasn't dead at the time, clearly, and I believe it's standard practice to cover burn victims with a wet sheet or something to that effect, as part of the first response. This was covered in the news reports on the day. She later died of a massive brain injury caused by a lack of oxygen. Think about it. She had been breathing hot smoke and shite for possibly 30 minutes. Her lungs would have filled up with all kinds of crap and ceased being any use after a few hours. When you burn your skin, what happens? Your body produces a blister. Your lungs aren't any different.
Read about Niki Lauda's accident at the Nordschleife or even watch the movie Rush, it goes into some detail about how the lungs react, over time, to inhaling noxious smoke in fires. It's really not uncommon for people to be pulled alive and alert from fires but die afterwards because their lungs suffer damage and can no longer get oxygen into the victim. No mystery here. Definitely no conspiracy.
Next!
Yeah I'm just pointing out that there will be theories not that I'm buying any of them or know what they are. Sure as you said it's news video and of course they'd be covered if they're burned. I'll leave other lads to make the stuff up and then maybe read them. Sounds like a bad death she got anyway
Ok so far we have "it's a man in a wig on the stretcher, she was killed to harvest her organs, she was killed because her new film is about to expose the illuminati, ellen degeneres has something to do with it" and the clintons got a mention or 2 as well. No Q yet but give it a day or 2. Definitely no good ones coming out of it anyway. She might turn up in Tartaria. RIP. Next....
https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20220823-what-makes-up-a-planes-contrails
You're aware that article won't change a single person's mind about what they think they're looking at every day?
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bAEDnF6z-DU&t=6651s
This popped up on YouTube and I listened to it. Looks like contrarian Rich Walker has fallen down the conspiratorial well alongside Rob Miller of Amebix.
It's hosted by a Dan Capp who I never heard of but I had listened to his dark folk band Wolscensmen previously. He seems to be well into the conspiracies. I looked him up after and an interview with an Irish webzine popped up. It's a covid era interview and much of it has not aged well at all for Dan or the interviewer.
https://www.swallowedinblack.com/wolcensmen-interview/
The whole thing is reflective of the current state of society. There's very little nuanced middleground. You're either a blind sheep who sleepwalks into government vaccine plans, no questions asked, or you're a chemtrail head who believes some evil cabal is running the whole world from behind a dark curtain.
Gas to start to look back at the 2020 and 21 and people's views of covid and their predictions for the future. It seems like another life entirely!
Quote from: astfgyl on August 24, 2022, 02:25:45 PMYou're aware that article won't change a single person's mind about what they think they're looking at every day?
I don't really mind, either way, as there's little point arguing with anyone who
chooses to believe the guff in the face of what it actually is. The link is there for anyone who starts to feel the pull of flat-earth gravitation. A helpline, if you will :)
Funny how any suspicion is instantly lumped in with flat earth carry on. Is that the motte and bailey fallacy I was reading about? Aren't the BBC subscribers to the Trusted News Initiative anyway so they can only tell the truth?
Quote from: Grim Reality on August 24, 2022, 08:33:37 PMhttps://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bAEDnF6z-DU&t=6651s
This popped up on YouTube and I listened to it. Looks like contrarian Rich Walker has fallen down the conspiratorial well alongside Rob Miller of Amebix.
It's hosted by a Dan Capp who I never heard of but I had listened to his dark folk band Wolscensmen previously. He seems to be well into the conspiracies. I looked him up after and an interview with an Irish webzine popped up. It's a covid era interview and much of it has not aged well at all for Dan or the interviewer.
https://www.swallowedinblack.com/wolcensmen-interview/
The whole thing is reflective of the current state of society. There's very little nuanced middleground. You're either a blind sheep who sleepwalks into government vaccine plans, no questions asked, or you're a chemtrail head who believes some evil cabal is running the whole world from behind a dark curtain.
Gas to start to look back at the 2020 and 21 and people's views of covid and their predictions for the future. It seems like another life entirely!
I listened to about 10-15 mins. of that the other day, had to turn it off. 'Lol we're cancelled but at keast we're not sheep lol'. Awful shite.
Capp was in Winterfylleth for a while, I think.
While we're on the theme of metal related theorists, Stephen Carpenter is pretty spectacular. All those plane journeys too.
Quote from: astfgyl on August 24, 2022, 09:07:35 PMFunny how any suspicion is instantly lumped in with flat earth carry on. Is that the motte and bailey fallacy I was reading about? Aren't the BBC subscribers to the Trusted News Initiative anyway so they can only tell the truth?
But of course! They go together. Unlike much of the cloak and dagger carry-on, where not everything is known, in the case of the natural world the facts are observable to all. One must actively choose to disagree with what the eyes and brain see and can process with a basic grasp of science, in favour of a convoluted and irrational narrative, easily self-disprovable if one did not yearn to believe in the sinister so much. They simply go together. They are Jack and Jill, Hansel and Gretel, Ant and Dec, if you will.
Not the natural world though is it? As far as I see, contrails are an entirely man made phenomenon. Then again, as man is part of the natural world, can all the things man does be considered natural (with the obvious exception of Ant and Dec)?
Ok so the latest rumour is that all the illegals crossing the channel into the uk are actually a UN army trained by British special forces in Turkey and Ukraine and are being brought in for the globalist takeover. It's only a new one so give it time
Do you actually believe this shit?
No
Quote from: Grim Reality on August 24, 2022, 08:33:37 PMhttps://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bAEDnF6z-DU&t=6651s
This popped up on YouTube and I listened to it. Looks like contrarian Rich Walker has fallen down the conspiratorial well alongside Rob Miller of Amebix.
It's hosted by a Dan Capp who I never heard of but I had listened to his dark folk band Wolscensmen previously. He seems to be well into the conspiracies. I looked him up after and an interview with an Irish webzine popped up. It's a covid era interview and much of it has not aged well at all for Dan or the interviewer.
https://www.swallowedinblack.com/wolcensmen-interview/
The whole thing is reflective of the current state of society. There's very little nuanced middleground. You're either a blind sheep who sleepwalks into government vaccine plans, no questions asked, or you're a chemtrail head who believes some evil cabal is running the whole world from behind a dark curtain.
Gas to start to look back at the 2020 and 21 and people's views of covid and their predictions for the future. It seems like another life entirely!
In not into conspiracies but I'm interested in hearing this. Does Richard mention anything about his recent health issues?
I think it's somewhere in between the 2 extremes. Most things are driven by profit I think but a lot just run with it and can't be convinced to look at the possibility they might be wrong. Hate both terms sheep and tinfoil hat because they're too dismissive
Quote from: Bürggermeister on August 29, 2022, 09:36:50 PMDo you actually believe this shit?
Quote from: astfgyl on August 29, 2022, 11:04:42 PMNo
This made me laugh harder than it should. Nutshell internet.
A much more localised conspiracy before was that meself and Astfgyl were the same person, egged on by us both admitting to being in the same band. Fair should have kept that going
Yeah there's another one doing the rounds that burggermeister is actually another user too but I know juggz isn't into the tinfoil hat stuff so it's hardly real
One and the same, I thougght it was obvious enouggh :laugh: If you know the password to the old one I can go back to using that.
Ah fair enough so. Well welcome back anyway. I was hoping you'd put up a bit more resistance for the thread's sake but I suppose an odd one has to be right to keep the whole thing going
Maybe I was spoofing... like Alex Jones, but slimmer :D
He got a right doing lately the knob
The amount of money he was making out of it is unreal
The conspiracy theory around that is that it's not about the money but about silencing him because he's waking too many people up. I'd never have thought he was that rich either
The main problem is that he's waking them up in a fictional reality, surely? One which is allowing the Russians and Chinese to think it's time to start rebuilding empires as the US is now seen as divided and weak, which they're clearly helping fuel. He's been spewing utter shite, making enormous sums of cash out of it, and making big money for his NRA benefactors too.
Is there anyone here who thinks he ever genuinely believed Sandy Hook was staged?
I wouldn't think there is but nothing would really surprise me. I think for the likes of Jones to be as popular as he is that there has to be nuggets of truth in there. That's enough then for folks to buy everything he says which is a silly move no matter who one is listening to. He throws in things like the cashless surveillance society, which is inevitable given today's technology, but then conflates that with all sorts of other things and there's eejits who love that thinking they know the secret lark. The last couple of years of governments acting as salesmen for massive corporations didn't help either but that wasn't a theory, it was just what happened be it by accident or design. So yeah there's a huge market for someone like Jones and if he gave it up there'd be another one on with little nuggets of truth to pick up the slack.
As much as I've no interest in Jones and haven't really ever had, it's another thing entirely to think the massive corporations and governments wouldn't be in cahoots and not all for our good but then I suppose how bothered one is about all the obvious things that are happening directly correlates to how many illicit things one wants to get their hands on and also how much one does our doesn't enjoy being watched and being analysed by AI.
It's also not lost on me that I'm on my phone feeding the thing but the type of conspiracy theories I enjoy are the more entertaining ones and not really the stuff that paints the future as even more bleak than it already looks because that's actually bad for the head if one gets too into it.
Something like the cancelling of the tartarian empire or such like but not to the flat earth and alien pyramids lark
I often think that someone like him, at this stage of the game, probably isn't really sure what he genuinely believes or not anymore, and also doesn't care. It works for him, or has done up until recently at least. He's not a person of integrity who might be concerned with plumbing what his actual convictions might be. Beyond making money and lots of it.
Didn't he refer to himself as some sort of fictional entertainment in his divorce proceedings a couple of years ago or am I remembering that right?
Alex Jones is controlled opposition just like David Icke and many others they are all actors playing a role. Like I said on here before these people are used to push crazy conspiracies along with genuine ones in order to discredit what is genuine. Anyone who is in a position of power even like Joe, Elon Musk etc. don't get to where they currently are without being compromised.
I've often considered that seeing as the internet never forgets that someone somewhere must have serious dirt on some world leaders and famous faces. I'd be amazed if they didn't. I also wonder about Epstein's connections and island visitors and who is compromised by that. And I wonder how Ghislaine Maxwell got convicted of child trafficking to nobody. That last one is a mad one but perhaps could be explained away by saying any released info could compromise some ongoing investigation.
There are some fucking nuts theories going that could be seen as obfuscation for sure
Liz Truss + prosthetic hand + novichok ???
Here's one I've just seen. The Queen has been dead for ages but it's only being announced now to distract everyone from something else happening and her meeting Liz Truss was photoshopped. It'll get more fun when lads try fill in the gaps in the theory
Given all the TV parasites are wearing black ties and such, it's likely the jig is up but not yet announced to the tax payers.
Plus "Queen Tribute Concert" was already used, so there's some brainstorming going down before the big announcement.
I'm waiting for the theories that she's still alive now
QuoteDIGITAL ONLY CURRENCY INCOMING !
You will be told that due to the queens death and the appointment of the King our cash will need to be altered.
You will be told its too expensive to alter the notes and coins, that the most economic option will be a digital only currency.
Likely or unlikely? I do like ones that can be quickly resolved
Several leagues beyond unlikely, living in a nice apartment in Nonsenseville. Queen's head coins will remain legal tender. It was not unusual, pre-metric system, for there to be several monarchs on the coins in one's pocket.
They took back control. They're not going to give it away so quickly.
On a more realistic note (!) it's more likely in the next few years that people will be going round with three monarchs in their pockets.
Here for the anniversary is what I guess is the most famous of them all. Building 7. Go to about 3 minutes in for many replays of it collapsing "due to fire". It looks extremely unlikely. That's leaving out the other two buildings and the pentagon entirely, just building 7. I reckon this was the single biggest factor in the growth of the entire conspiracy theory movement due to how unlikely the official explanation looks and the fact it was announced as collapsed about 20 minutes before it actually happened.
Anyway: https://rumble.com/v1jcf9c-911-extract-from-the-movie-silverfish.html
I haven't watched the full clip yet so I dunno what they'll say next or how realistic it'll be. Just building 7.
Edit: I will say that the "pull it" comment isn't the gotcha it's made out to be, because he could easily have meant to pull out the firefighters from the rescue effort rather than displaying his knowledge of demolition slang.
Edit 2: I turned it off at 11 minutes when the narrator suggests that The Simpsons knew about the plan in 1997. Oh well
Found one of the best I've seen yet..
Donald Trump is the Jewish Messiah. I dunno if that counts as a conspiracy theory but it's one of the best theories I've seen
https://twitter.com/DonnieDarkened/status/1529486051194155009?t=vPXb6AgjAsGN58KPlYbXYg&s=19
Seems he's the beast of revelations too, or is that the same thing?
https://westawake.substack.com/p/why-did-ireland-open-an-embassy-in?utm_source=twitter&sd=pf
Here's an interesting one:
"Why did Ireland open an embassy in Ukraine in 2019?"
I've no idea but there's some food for thought in there. I'd like to hear the other side of the initial impression if anyone has that.
Answer: Ireland opened 10 new embassies in 2019 and three were planned to open in 2020 which, due to the global pandemic, couldn't open until later.
https://www.thejournal.ie/irish-embassies-4416114-Jan2019/
"Coveney said "there is an element of a Brexit strategy" in opening these new embassies in terms of some sectors having an over-reliance on trade with the UK, stating that there are new markets Irish businesses can tap into."
The west may be awake but it looks like his search engine of choice is still asleep.
Quote from: Bürggermeister on September 24, 2022, 06:54:20 PMAnswer: Ireland opened 10 new embassies in 2019 and three were planned to open in 2020 which, due to the global pandemic, couldn't open until later.
https://www.thejournal.ie/irish-embassies-4416114-Jan2019/
"Coveney said "there is an element of a Brexit strategy" in opening these new embassies in terms of some sectors having an over-reliance on trade with the UK, stating that there are new markets Irish businesses can tap into."
The west may be awake but it looks like his search engine of choice is still asleep.
Sound. That's why I asked for the rest of the story fair play. Looks innocent.
https://twitter.com/thethwarter/status/1577534293500432384?t=kItp0Ftv2PTUlCLZjMWsZw&s=19
Ok, debunk this: Michelle Obama is a man and Joan rivers was killed for exposing it.
Now we're getting to the good stuff
The earthquakes were caused by the US and their haarp machine. Here was me thinking that was supposed to do weather
Interesting article by Seymour Hersh today.
Who is he?
The US and Norway blew up Nordstream 2.
Have to get a nice believable and probable one in there every now and again!
Quote from: mickO))) on February 08, 2023, 10:44:23 PMInteresting article by Seymour Hersh today.
Meant to quote you up above but don't want to write it again
https://www.popularmechanics.com/science/energy/a42419268/6g-power-humans-antennas/
I don't have the theory at the ready but let it be remembered that I was in the first wave of 6G hatters
This is a pretty interesting analysis of the "Satanic Panic" ( :abbath: ) of the 1980s, going into its deep historical roots, socio-psychological mechanisms, and legacy into more recent conspiracies such as QAnon. On the whole, it also serves as a pretty good warning, especially for folk like us who would also have been prime suspect targets during the satanic panic, of how to recognize when narratives are more conspiracy than reality:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NgmPQGWn8pI
The most frustrating thing is watching this exact bullshit being repackaged and then spread by, as you said, people who would've been the prime target back in the day and therefore should know better.
Well tbf I love a good theory or two but the Q stuff is right up there with the flat earth in terms of likeliness. I think going the whole way in either direction is a bit much anyway, between everything is a giant plan and nothing to see here ever.
Might get a look at that video later
https://edition.cnn.com/interactive/2023/03/us/oklahoma-city-bombing-yeakey-death-cec-cnnphotos/
Here's a good one.
So the lad cut his own wrists and throat and then ran half a mile from his car to shoot himself in the head.
No autopsy because obvious suicide
Lol
Impending explosion of cognitive dissonance among crypto bro Musk fanboys as a World Economic Forum associated player is floated to be next CEO of Twitter. Love it. Hope it causes a maximum of them to turn their backs on him (if it turns out to be true).
It won't though because they're addicted to Twitter. They'll stay on there to give out about it.
Also who isn't associated with the WEF these days?
I was nearly thinking of joining em myself
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1657050349608501249?t=s64B-j5-Q6aVNoFIA5IBeA&s=19
Ah here we go
That tweet has provided the perfect opportunity for me to check whether the automatic blue tick profile blocker extension I added to Firefox during the week is working properly. A resounding yes! :laugh:
Well worth doing, especially since the introduction of Twitter Blue users replies being boosted to the top on all tweets. Pretty smart customization options with it too.
Ah no way I didn't know there was an extension like that. Must see if I can get it on Edge. Twitter blue and paying for your opinion to be boosted is very shit. Blue ticks being earned rather than bought was way better
Are you obliged to use Edge?? Hate that if so.
No I could use any other browsers but I'm so lazy that when I got a laptop off a chap I just didn't bother going looking. I would have probably changed at some point but the adblock works great on Edge. Even soap2day can't get an ad through. Might be worth throwing on Firefox for that extension if I can't get it on Edge though
Signed up for the world economic forum last night.
Sweet Jesus
No conspiracy just a different reality altogether
Was going for the trump thread but as this is theory of the conspiratorial kind I decided to throw it here. Something I came across on Twitter.
https://twitter.com/dom_lucre/status/1661830356629172224?t=FNqxyDxuxC_vW3_gVaxyGA&s=19
Now this is apolitical as I see it because if 2020 was an issue that way well then so was 2016 so there's the partisan minds blown by the paradox that they themselves have created
There was no submarine
The people on the submarine were done away with
There's no Titanic down there, it's some other ship
The fella who was in the sub was a member of seti and was going to blow the whistle on operation bluebeam which is due to happen imminently.
That's what I've seen in the last 5 mins on Twitter and all I wanted was to check the transfer news
Yeah, Tubridy is some cunt trying to distract everyone from his wages.
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Hunter Biden is thanking tubridy as we speak
Quote from: Yung Led Zeppelin on July 06, 2020, 10:04:47 AMQuote from: astfgyl on July 05, 2020, 10:21:41 PMThe planes are spraying something.
Yes, it's called exhaust fumes and happens as a result of combustion engines. Temperatures at the altitudes the planes operate at are low enough for this to condense.
Supposedly it's ice crystals actually. I'm open to suggestion on stuff but there's a definite change in the trails planes leave behind in the last 20 years or so. Maybe it's the sheer volume of planes in the sky or changes in stratospheric temps etc but surely no-one over the age of 40 can't see the difference, whatever is causing it.
Sorry to historically quote you, I hit the first page by accident and saw it. I think I was wrong to say they are spraying something but I can see the trails all the same
Denver airport
That one might be my favourite, mental place
Only heard of it today I must read a bit more about it but it's a mad place for sure
I've actually been there and all, but sadly before I heard about the conspiracy theories, would've paid more attention/explored if I knew!
Found some Nuclear Bomb deniers on twitter there, Hiroshima and Nagasaki never actually happened apparently, no solid evidence to support it. Fuckin lol
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Fuck me I love a good theory but I'm filing that one with flat earth and concentration camps had swimming pools and free healthcare
Quote from: Yung Led Zeppelin on June 25, 2023, 11:08:04 AMI've actually been there and all, but sadly before I heard about the conspiracy theories, would've paid more attention/explored if I knew!
There's a load of stuff like that around where I feel like the designers are just fucking with people
As the young people might say, some end-of-level-boss conspiracy shit going down 😂
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/qanon-leader-michael-protzman-death-conspiracy-b2371237.html
Quote from: Bürggermeister on July 08, 2023, 09:58:22 PMAs the young people might say, some end-of-level-boss conspiracy shit going down 😂
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/qanon-leader-michael-protzman-death-conspiracy-b2371237.html
Jesus Christ they actually turned up to see if JFK would be resurrected. That's not paranoia, that's straight up madness. Anyway I thought Q was supposed to be a time traveller and no mention of the possibility he might have simply gone back to the future
Again? :laugh:
Might be of interest: video essay on various aspects of conspiracy theorizing, using Russell Brand as a central case study. I follow this guy's channel, generally well made and researched.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yr5e38RznKY
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on December 12, 2023, 11:21:16 PMMight be of interest: video essay on various aspects of conspiracy theorizing, using Russell Brand as a central case study. I follow this guy's channel, generally well made and researched.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yr5e38RznKY
Brand saw the money to be made I think and did what anyone using YouTube for an income would do. I doubt he believes in a lot of the things he says but then I've never really rated him anyway. The covid lark is just too obvious of a cash cow not to find something underhanded in some of it. All one has to do is look at the wealth transfer it caused and without even getting as stuck into it as I did, anyone can see there were scams galore involved. As for his wef opposition shtick, Well i joined the wef myself about a year ago and I don't think it's what it's made it to be but also it's exactly what one would think it is at the same time, ie globalism. I haven't actually watched the video but even calling out the likes of Brand seems like a waste of time to me, akin to calling out David Icke or something
As I said, it really just uses Brand as a case study for deeper and broader analysis of what conspiracy theorizing consists of as a general human phenomenon.
Well I think people want theories to be true because it would add context to the general feeling that the world's gone mad. Half of em are true anyway if you look into them but them all being in some way connected into a grand plan just doesn't do it for me. I'd imagine it's far more compartmentalised in nature but i wouldn't be heading to youtube with it. The likes of Brand and many more are just more cynical or maybe realist and may as well make the money while it's on offer. Conspiracy docs and anti conspiracy docs are a bad as each other really like what's the real case to study other than everything is so shit and so stupid for so many that it's as easy to believe it's on purpose rather than it's the inevitable result of human nature?
We get it, everything is as bad as everything else.
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on December 19, 2023, 06:55:25 PMWe get it, everything is as bad as everything else.
If you want to simplify it to the point of making it all seem beneath the intelligence of your own worldview, then yeah sure that must be it
Just taking the piss out of you. You say X is as bad as Y a lot. When X is clearly not as bad. Despite Elon's best efforts. Don't mind me, evening smoke.
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on December 19, 2023, 09:58:12 PMJust taking the piss out of you. You say X is as bad as Y a lot. When X is clearly not as bad. Despite Elon's best efforts. Don't mind me, evening smoke.
If you think I'm a musk fan of any sort then you will have badly misjudged me. I like things to be fair and decent and I'll listen to any opinion that challenges my own. So I obviously disagree with the way the wind is blowing lately but I will also disagree with whatever way it blows next because its always the same rotten outcome. I'm sick of saying I'm a traditional leftist, not whatever it's tied up in nowadays. The same real problems are still the same real problems and maybe this week it's left and maybe next week it's right but it's actually the middle that's being wiped out. Divide and conquer has never been easier but enjoy taking a position if that's what works for you
X... Twitter... Musk... THC :laugh:
What baffles me is that the majority of people seem perfectly happy to accept the premise that governments and multinational organisations are, in theory, conspiring for the grater good, yet completely unwilling to entertain the premise that these same organisations could, in theory, be conspiring in their own interests and to the detriment of the greater good.
"They"'re doing both those things. That's why there's an awful lot more human randomness, chaos, disruption, and consequent opportunism than conspiracy theorists tend to allow for.
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on December 19, 2023, 10:51:21 PM"They"'re doing both those things. That's why there's an awful lot more human randomness, chaos, disruption, and consequent opportunism than conspiracy theorists tend to allow for.
You've just made the exact point I did in my last go at thinking about it there. 2 posts back, exact same point
Ok, I'm not talking about left and right though, maybe you weren't really either. Anyway, been plenty of self-serving actions on "the left", been plenty of genuine good actions on "the right" and vice versa.
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on December 19, 2023, 10:51:21 PM"They"'re doing both those things. That's why there's an awful lot more human randomness, chaos, disruption, and consequent opportunism than conspiracy theorists tend to allow for.
I agree with ya to a point. There's bad actors and good actors in all organisations that wield power.
This is why it's so important to keep a keen eye on the actions of these organisations, for fear the bad actors work their way into positions of influence and corrupt the organisations for their own nefarious ends.
To label the people who question the actions of organisations they fear have been corrupted as "conspiracy theorists", and in doing so poo pooing their concerns, is dangerous and plays directly into the hands of those who would do evil (not to be overly dramatic).
This is exactly why the FBI introduced the term "conspiracy theory" into the public consciousness following the assassination of JFK.
Its a dangerous fucking label and shouldn't be used at all.
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on December 19, 2023, 11:17:02 PMOk, I'm not talking about left and right though, maybe you weren't really either. Anyway, been plenty of self-serving actions on "the left", been plenty of genuine good actions on "the right" and vice versa.
Ah I get you now. I wasn't going for the left/ right either. They're both wrong and both right indeed.
Fill yer boots
https://documentaryheaven.com/category/conspiracy/
QuoteSuper Bowl conspiracy theories involving Taylor Swift are "nonsense", says NFL commissioner Roger Goodell.
Music superstar Swift is dating Kansas City Chiefs tight end Travis Kelce, whose team will compete in their fourth Super Bowl in five years on Sunday.
Right-wing critics say their relationship is part of a plot to rig the NFL's championship game and help get US President Joe Biden re-elected.
Does this mean the 49ers are Team Trump?
Kate Middleton shot the Boeing whistleblower.
https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1029/2019JA026607
This seems to be the basis of many theories about those northern lights we were looking at. I only skimmed it but I was waiting for it to kick in. Solar storm seems a lot more plausible to me due to the widespread nature of the event tbf, and those results in that paper don't look like the northern lights to me but I still enjoy reading some of the maddest theories eg it's a test run for project blue beam etc
And then there's this: https://eurovision.tv/story/eurovision-2024-theme-art-revealed
And now the theory is that it was eurovision related
A recent favourite -
The "Dead Internet Theory" is a conspiracy theory that suggests a significant portion of the internet has been taken over by artificial intelligence (AI), automated bots, and government or corporate entities, rather than being populated by real human users. According to proponents of this theory, a large amount of online content, including social media posts, blog comments, and even entire websites, is generated by AI or bots with the aim of manipulating public opinion, controlling narratives, or simply creating the illusion of a bustling internet full of human activity.
Quote from: The Butcher on August 28, 2024, 08:35:34 PMA recent favourite -
The "Dead Internet Theory" is a conspiracy theory that suggests a significant portion of the internet has been taken over by artificial intelligence (AI), automated bots, and government or corporate entities, rather than being populated by real human users. According to proponents of this theory, a large amount of online content, including social media posts, blog comments, and even entire websites, is generated by AI or bots with the aim of manipulating public opinion, controlling narratives, or simply creating the illusion of a bustling internet full of human activity.
I think it's true except for the conspiracy part and has been for a long time but not ai, just bots scratching each others arses for clicks and advertising etc. Ochoill told me about it a while back and it was indeed fascinating and strangely unnerving
There's definitely truth to it! I suppose no one really knows the extend of it.
Do you remember Google dreaming? The dead Internet gives me the same sort of dread as that did. If that's the shit that the machine imagines for itself then I'm glad I'm the age I am.
I really do love a good conspiracy theory but in a weekly world news style rather than the modern ones that are just way too actually happening and generally bad for one's mental health were one to think too hard about them.
Never heard that dead Internet one before, probably not too far off the truth really
Dead internet is absolutely proven real but yeah it is less for manipulating opinion and actually just to skim money off ads.
You both/automate tasks to do certain things and with AI it is significantly easier to do.
- skim internet/social media for hot topics
- record data
- rank and sort data
- query ChatGPT or similar on it
- ask it to write an article on it
- tell it what way you want it written (based on your data)
- give it some checks etc
- make a blog/site
- post to blog/site and social media
- take this new article
- put it back into chatgpt and ask it to counter it in less than 200 characters
- use this with a new account to comment on original post
- repeat
- repeat
- make sure the blog or link is being shared on S.M.
- make sure it is rattled with ads
- every bot visit and comment counts as a view and appears legitimate
Every single step above can be automated on a mass scale and every "click" off a bot is ad revenue. No human interaction needed. What you end up with of course is a total inhuman mess perpetuating itself but a few lads running bots making money until they get figured out and shut down, but it's whack a mole style anyway, makes no odds.
That's the general gist of the articles I read on it anyway. Which were probably written by and shared by bots :laugh:
Spotify seemingly has bot artists that have loads of short tunes in playlists etc just making cash for them. Haven't come across them myself but I don't tend to listen to Spotify made playlists.
Aye, there were some links in the AI thread in the main forum a while back.
I work on a site in Dublin a couple of days a week. Girl serving in the canteen today telling me about the lights over Ireland etc the past few nights. Says it's aliens...
She proceeded to say Michael Jackson and Tupac are still alive, that they were taken away by aliens to save them. The child abuse was just slander so they had to take him away for protection.
The South Park Jackson line "no, that's just ignorance" didn't spring to mind at the time unfortunately :laugh:
Since you've bumped this, anyone into contrapoints YouTube channel, she just released a video about conspiracies. I haven't watched it all yet, but Tupac has already been mentioned :laugh:
Apologies, maybe I should just have found the tales of ordinary madness thread or whatever it is. Same thing really I guess.
I guess Tupac has a new album coming out then with all this bandwidth he appears to be getting!
It's fittingly eerie that you resurrect this thread the day after I start watching a video about conspiracies in which Tupac is mentioned... one or both of us is clearly under control! :laugh:
Quote from: Snare on March 25, 2025, 08:47:58 PMApologies, maybe I should just have found the tales of ordinary madness thread or whatever it is. Same thing really I guess.
I guess Tupac has a new album coming out then with all this bandwidth he appears to be getting!
He pretty much lived in the studio banking as much stuff as he could to get out of the Death Row contract and his estate's been drip feeding it since, but dumb folks watch a YouTube/Tik Tok and end up being absolute head wreckers.
Mercifully, Hitler and Elvis are now too old to not be dead. The oul celebrities are hoors for the not-really-dying thing.
Nah man fuck that, Hitler is definitely still in Antarctica
I must go back through this and find the one I posted where the theory was that Trump was the antichrist
https://www.thejournal.ie/conor-mcgregor-tucker-carlson-freemasons-6682426-Apr2025/
QuoteTHE FREEMASONS' HALL in Dublin has said that if it had known that Conor McGregor and Tucker Carlson were going to use the space, they would not have accepted the booking.
Hired a Freemasons' venue to talk about (presumably) political conspiracy theories, and then get disowned by the Freemasons :laugh: :laugh:
Just watching the interview and it being in the Freemason's hall was the first laugh I got out of it.
Goldmine for conspiracy theories in this Spain/Portugal power outage! Cyberattack or "rare atmospheric phenomenon" or...supervillain doomsday machine test...? :D
Oh it's all directed energy weapons these days!! The supervillains need to start getting some new ideas :laugh:
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on April 28, 2025, 06:16:26 PMGoldmine for conspiracy theories in this Spain/Portugal power outage! Cyberattack or "rare atmospheric phenomenon" or...supervillain doomsday machine test...? :D
Jesus I just read some of the stuff. Three quarters of these people simply have to be taking the piss for clicks
Maybe it was MTG's jewish space lasers, up to no good again
Quote from: Bürggermeister on April 29, 2025, 01:13:46 PMMaybe it was MTG's jewish space lasers, up to no good again
It's fine, all you have to do is paint the roof blue and it doesn't work, supposedly
https://x.com/17thSCOG/status/1917147833779486955?t=w9Aifwboyra3-O2NQJqZOQ&s=19
Here's some of the good stuff. Conspiracy inside Conspiracy lol. Haven't seen any of this in a while but it's usually great craic
Ulster says no to 5G.
https://www.rte.ie/news/ulster/2025/0608/1517336-belfast-5g-masts/
It's gas the connections that Epstein had to power. Peter Mandelson has been sacked for his connections to Epstein. The letters he sent Epstein are the stuff of a fawning schoolgirl.
As Mandelson is a notorious queer what was his interest in been jetted off to stay at Epsteins villas?
An article at https://www.standard.co.uk/comment/peter-mandelson-us-ambassador-washington-gay-icon-b1201270.html makes the point he was close to Trump -
"As such, becoming the closest official British conduit to Donald Trump through his second US presidency"
No doubt he hung around with Trump in the company of Epstein etc
Quote from: The Butcher on August 28, 2024, 08:35:34 PMA recent favourite -
The "Dead Internet Theory" is a conspiracy theory that suggests a significant portion of the internet has been taken over by artificial intelligence (AI), automated bots, and government or corporate entities, rather than being populated by real human users. According to proponents of this theory, a large amount of online content, including social media posts, blog comments, and even entire websites, is generated by AI or bots with the aim of manipulating public opinion, controlling narratives, or simply creating the illusion of a bustling internet full of human activity.
Been thinking about this one a lot lately. It's gotten to the point where almost every entertainment or pop culture article being pitched to me seems to be AI-generated now. I'm also noticing an enormous amount of FB posts and articles that are AI generated. The latest trend seems to be AI generated posts or stories that are straight up made up (celebrity X said this controversial thing about celeb Y, that never even remotely happened. Pulled out of thin air) to generate engagement. Or else weird historical summaries or opinions, particularly around sports, but could be anything really, designed to generate engagement. It's obviously been happening to varying degrees for years, but it's the first time I've truly felt like so much of what I see is completely fake that it is almost truly useless to be online at all now, bar the odd site like this one. The true embodiment of the dead internet theory. The only thing keeping me going online at the minute is the obvious smartphone addiction that has been purposely programmed into me (and most of us). I do wonder where it will evolve to next though. The internet and social media won't die, but they will have to evolve and I wonder where that will lead to.
The lack of accountability for platform owners means this shit will only get worse. You couldn't publish physical media with most of the shit on social media without living in court. Once dopes click, the cheques clear. Repeat. Who gives a fuck about the consequences?
It's good, in a way. So much shit out there means I spend less time aimlessly browsing and just go to the small handful of sites I know are not spasticated, then disengage.
I'm trying but it's difficult. The mindless doom scroll is so deeply engrained at this point that I find myself doing it without even realizing I've started doing it. What a fucking waste of time. At least the amount of obvious fakeness is helping a little in that regard though as it is lifting me out of the haze and genuinely turning me away.
The dead internet theory stops being theoretical when you see something like this. 49 million accounts and that's only from a single bot farm. It only takes 20 of these setups over the world and you've got almost 1 billion accounts posting shit everywhere
https://thehackernews.com/2025/10/europol-dismantles-sim-farm-network.html
https://youtu.be/Z-ImysXws-0
Yet the me wana banana guy was allegedly human.
Quote from: Mooncat on October 27, 2025, 05:37:57 PMI'm trying but it's difficult. The mindless doom scroll is so deeply engrained at this point that I find myself doing it without even realizing I've started doing it. What a fucking waste of time. At least the amount of obvious fakeness is helping a little in that regard though as it is lifting me out of the haze and genuinely turning me away.
Pretty much this. I recently reactivated dormant FB and Instagram for God knows why...partially out of boredom and curiosity, and I'm wondering why I bothered. Even if you park the AI stuff (which is hard to ignore as its so prevalent), it's all so toxic. I get a lot of MMA spam as I used to follow the UFC closely enough, not so much these days, but the amount of shite talk about the Aspinall/Gane fight is staggering. Just waves and waves of keyboard warriors and trolls throwing in their ill-informed tuppence worth.
Quote from: Bürggermeister on October 28, 2025, 09:09:51 AMYet the me wana banana guy was allegedly human.
There was a guy on here I did half wonder at one point if he was a bot or not. DJ something?
Quote from: John Kimble on October 28, 2025, 03:10:36 PMQuote from: Mooncat on October 27, 2025, 05:37:57 PMI'm trying but it's difficult. The mindless doom scroll is so deeply engrained at this point that I find myself doing it without even realizing I've started doing it. What a fucking waste of time. At least the amount of obvious fakeness is helping a little in that regard though as it is lifting me out of the haze and genuinely turning me away.
Pretty much this. I recently reactivated dormant FB and Instagram for God knows why...partially out of boredom and curiosity, and I'm wondering why I bothered. Even if you park the AI stuff (which is hard to ignore as its so prevalent), it's all so toxic. I get a lot of MMA spam as I used to follow the UFC closely enough, not so much these days, but the amount of shite talk about the Aspinall/Gane fight is staggering. Just waves and waves of keyboard warriors and trolls throwing in their ill-informed tuppence worth.
I've been getting a ton of the same on my feed as well. Pause for more than a few seconds on something and then you're flooded with it for weeks. You almost have to train yourself to skip over things you would be half-interested in but not interested enough to be bombarded with. I have an overload of Gane/Aspinall stuff too despite the
mildest of passing interest in UFC.
Also comments sections are genuinely one of the most depressing places on Earth. Everyone thinks their opinion is equivalent to that of professionals and experts. What a shitshow.
Quote from: Mooncat on October 28, 2025, 04:28:05 PMThere was a guy on here I did half wonder at one point if he was a bot or not. DJ something?
Sniffles. No he is real, I bumped into him a couple of times at gigs in Limerick and there are a few other lads here who have too. He's actually the solid finest, he was in his teens and discovering metal so was out sneaking into gigs in Dolan's, gas :laugh:
Dead Internet is real and very disheartening, and something I am obsessed with but I won't dig into it here at the minute in a brief post. There's a lot of rejection online for the way things have gone though, which is good, especially in creative communities. Forums like here of course, a couple of odd sites in between. Have been digging into Neocities a bit while doing some sites meself and there's mad stuff there. Bandcamp and some more curated IG pages are mostly okay. But AI and bots have 99% of the Internet unusable.
Wasn't there a theory that some plan would only be complete when we all couldn't tell what was real or not?
Quote from: astfgyl on October 28, 2025, 07:24:28 PMWasn't there a theory that some plan would only be complete when we all couldn't tell what was real or not?
Probably but as it turns out this is also the whole point of Arsenal Gear in MGS2. Hilariously relevant plot given the way everything is today
Quote from: ochoill on October 28, 2025, 07:32:21 PMQuote from: astfgyl on October 28, 2025, 07:24:28 PMWasn't there a theory that some plan would only be complete when we all couldn't tell what was real or not?
Probably but as it turns out this is also the whole point of Arsenal Gear in MGS2. Hilariously relevant plot given the way everything is today
I tried looking it up but only got that it wasn't real. Still in all that's likely where most of us will end up. I could see people giving up on a lot of the internet over it
I don't use fb or insta anymore (great decision lads!), but a girl I know has recently started sharing her daily social media scutter via that WhatsApp status update thing, so every time I open my app, there's a wee green notification and sometimes mindlessly tap it and subject myself to her shite.
The latest is her sharing a video of a woman who is convinced that the recent hurricane Melissa is man-made, and that the governments are taking down weather stations so that they will be able to wipe out ENTIRE COUNTRIES, read it again: ENTIRE COUNTRIES, and we somehow won't hear about it. She posted a screenshot of a weather station, which usually updates every x amount of minutes, but hasn't updated in 3 hours now. God forbid that there was a fucking problem with satellite link like!
I got off the bus when I got to the part where she talks about how convenient it is that Jamaica has been approved to build Smart Cities, and now it's about to be wiped out to clear the way for construction to go ahead.
Quote from: astfgyl on October 28, 2025, 07:47:22 PMI could see people giving up on a lot of the internet over it
I had a conversation with some friends only recently about how good the internet was before it was all ads and regulations and shite, nevermind the bots and AI even.
Quote from: Giggles on October 28, 2025, 08:03:31 PMI don't use fb or insta anymore (great decision lads!), but a girl I know has recently started sharing her daily social media scutter via that WhatsApp status update thing, so every time I open my app, there's a wee green notification and sometimes mindlessly tap it and subject myself to her shite.
The latest is her sharing a video of a woman who is convinced that the recent hurricane Melissa is man-made, and that the governments are taking down weather stations so that they will be able to wipe out ENTIRE COUNTRIES, read it again: ENTIRE COUNTRIES, and we somehow won't hear about it. She posted a screenshot of a weather station, which usually updates every x amount of minutes, but hasn't updated in 3 hours now. God forbid that there was a fucking problem with satellite link like!
I got off the bus when I got to the part where she talks about how convenient it is that Jamaica has been approved to build Smart Cities, and now it's about to be wiped out to clear the way for construction to go ahead.
Quote from: astfgyl on October 28, 2025, 07:47:22 PMI could see people giving up on a lot of the internet over it
I had a conversation with some friends only recently about how good the internet was before it was all ads and regulations and shite, nevermind the bots and AI even.
Interestingly, it's kind of been out there for a year or so that people are moving off social media and into chat groups, where they feel more private and safe from all the bullshit. I've read a few articles about it here and there. I didn't know that Whatsapp had started doing that, but I guess this is the corporate way of starting to infiltrate chat groups now as well. Only a matter of time before the ads make their way there too I suppose. Utterly brazen, and utterly stupid. Like take the hint lads if you want people to stay on your platforms.
The absolute fucking state of the Internet has given me serious cause for concern, esp when it comes to parenting. I have a nine year old daughter who is obsessed with watching those short clips on YouTube...relatively benign stuff or so I thought until recently. She was watching this fairly innocuous clip the other day in the car, the audio was coming through the speaker on Bluetooth...nothing of note until an AI voice at the end declared something along the lines of "like and subscribe or your parents hate you". Fuck sake like. Myself and the missus had to have one of those "frank conversations" with her about the nonsense on YouTube, and re-evaluate our own tendencies towards lazy parenting at times. Like, your working from home or in a restaurant and it's an easy option to just hand them the phone for the sake of a few minutes peace. It's a recurring request every now and then as to "when can I get a mobile phone" and the answer now is a resolute no. Not a fucking hope in hell.
Well at least we have this place to give out about it all on. I still scroll for a few funny cat videos on Twitter but I can't even trust them now with the AI stuff. Ah well
Yeah, once you give 'em a phone they're gone. My 16 year old has the whole world and it's nefarious politics and perversions at the touch of a button 24/7, often you don't even need the button, it'll come anyway, uninvited. To put it in context I was renting out Sega consoles at 16 years of age and staying up all night trying to complete Sonic the fucking Hedgehog.
And sneaking out to burn down churchs with Mayhem on the Walkman obvs.
Fair oul squeeze getting yourself and all of Mayhem on one walkman, no?
Well..Dead didn't make it.
He made a mess, that's what he made.