Coronavirus

[Carnage]

That page is quite frustrating indeed, I've given up on trying to get any kind of information on anything local. It's quite vague in that respect, for all its talk of detailed figures, maps etc.

[astfgyl]

It also doesn't give the number of active cases per county, or in total. I know that somebody has all the detailed stats I am after but I will have to give the benefit of doubt for now and suppose it isn't collated, although it is difficult not to be a little suspicious as to why extremely detailed stats are not readily available.

[mickO)))]

It seems to be very difficult to get proper figures anywhere and now it's coming out that lots of deaths are just being classed as corona deaths even though they weren't so who knows what the real numbers are.

Not corna related but it will be very interesting to see how this General Flynn / James Comey thing plays out. It could be the start of something huge.

[Pedrito]

What's the Flynn/Comey thing?

[Black Shepherd Carnage]

This thread is sprawling enough, take the Comey thing elsewhere 

What do you mean by deaths classed as covid "even though they weren't" though? That could mean a couple of things.

[Pedrito]

  gwan ourrovih

[astfgyl]

I reckon he is alluding to the idea that maybe some people that died of other causes, but also had C19 were classed as dying of it, even though they strictly might not have and it might be more that they died with it. Like say someone dies of a heart attack or something not CV related but they were an asymptomatic carrier, they will in the current course of things be classed as a C19 death regardless of whether that killed them or not. For example if I have a common cold and die of liver failure due to years of self abuse, what did I die of? I think he means that sort of thing. Of course I accept that will take a long to become clear or it might never become clear at all, but the current classification says that if you have it and you also die, then you died of it.

[mickO)))]

What's the Flynn/Comey thing?

He was Trumps advisor, forced to take a plea bargain and resign over the whole Russia thing following news reports about his communications with the Russian ambassador. But its coming out now that the FBI doctored evidence in his case, his own lawyer withheld exculpatory evidence that would have proved him innocent and Robert Muller threatened him and his son to try to get them to give false evidence against Trump.

Apparently Flynn has a lot of dirt on people as well but is currently under a gag order as part of the plea bargain he was forced into. Once he is cleared he will be free to share all this stuff with the world.

Trump has mentioned him a few times over the last few weeks in his press conferences calling the people that convicted him human scum.

So this could get the ball rolling and lead back to a lot of very high profile people. Of course very little mainstream media coverage about the whole thing even though it could end up being one of the biggest political scandal of all time.

[mickO)))]

What do you mean by deaths classed as covid "even though they weren't" though? That could mean a couple of things.

I read a news article that said people who had corona then died of something unrelated were being classed as corona deaths and then another article saying that most deaths even when the person wasn't tested were being classed as corona deaths as well because autopsies were are not being performed. 

[Black Shepherd Carnage]

Historically, how do you think death numbers for Spanish flu, etc., were calculated? There's always a huge part of estimation involved, during an epidemic most deaths significantly above the average for the time of year will be attributed to the epidemic disease. It's not feasible to carry out autopsies on everyone when in many places even the funeral homes can't cope with the surge.

As for the difference between dying from and dying with, it seems clear, again from the surges, that COVID-19 is at the very least accelerating people towards the grave. So, do you say Joe Bloggs died of X or of X accelerated by COVID-19? Causally speaking, that's not an easy question to answer. 

[astfgyl]

If a certain amount of people are asymptomatic, it stands to reason that a number of asymptomatic cases will be reported as dying with it regardless of the actual cause of death and who knows it might not even have accelerated any given asymptomatic case towards fatality or it might have accelerated them all to it. I agree that is not an easy question to answer and I honestly think we may never get to the bottom of it. I don't think it is clear cut at all or that it ever will be. Certainly an interesting facet to the debate though.

Do you play chess at all?

[astfgyl]

Looking forward to hearing tonight's announcement of the roadmap to recovery?

I can't get this out of me head the last few weeks, but I don't think I will get any result tonight...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Kk5iXZFaCQ&t=58s

[Black Shepherd Carnage]

So much for Tipperary related sarcasm:
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/may/01/covid-19-outbreaks-at-irish-meat-plants-raise-fears-over-worker-safety

[astfgyl]

That's me told so. I shall endeavour to temper my sarcasm in the future.

And yet the fact remains that Tipperary has its' lowest amount of deaths for the last 4 years this year so far. Also, when did these test happen? How many of the workers died? Was correct social distancing applied? Was the correct PPE provided? So many questions, so few answers, such scant data....

Is this failure the fault of the common citizen or of large business interests?

[Emphyrio]

Schools closed til September. Twas expected but still. Mad stuff.