The PC and Perpetually Offended Brigade

[ldj]

The problem isn't the protests, it's who the protests are directed at (the migrants themselves) as well as the message (seems to be a lot of focus on scaremongering about foreigners, rather than the real problem being housing).

And as I said months ago when a protest happened in my area, where have all of these self-appointed defenders of the community been the last 40 year while local drug gangs have been destroying the place.

Pointing that out isn't defending the goverment, sure they love the fact there's a scapegoat to take the focus off of them, these protesters don't even realise they're doing exactly what the government want them to do.

[open face surgery]

This is it in a nutshell.

[astfgyl]

Surely this particular Garda claim works in favour of the position (which I take to be yours) that the majority of protestors are ordinary local people with genuine (albeit, I would say, misdirected) concerns about their community and that any shenanigans are the work of a minority whose primary interests are not community-based.

Ashtree Risk Group manager and former Garda Inspector Tony Gallagher: "The vast majority of people are out for legitimate reasons to protests, and it's unfortunate to see this type of thing seeping in and overthrowing a legitimate reason [for protesting]."

You really do see conspiracy everywhere.

Now this isn't me picking at your point about people being misdirected in their concerns because I agree with you that in no way should the migrants be the target of the general ire at all, but it did strike me that you don't live here and got me thinking about your points on it in general.

I honestly think that you would have to live here - in rural Ireland, to truly appreciate the pace of the change and the scale of the change. It's not going to be as noticeable in the cities fair enough and as you have moved to a country far ahead of us in these terms, you will likely have a different perspective on levels of middle Eastern lads in your locality and that's understandable.

However, think of this from the perspective of your general non yoke taking average Joe from the small town or local townslands who isn't used to bigging it up with the United colours of Benetton and you'd have to be sedated to cope with the massive shift in everything.

I can fully understand what their fears are, even though I myself have plenty of experience with the new lads and they're fine and friendly and will fit in no bother given a bit of time. That will not allay the fears of the average rte watching, mass going, hurling playing/supporting, pub drinking, Chinese takeaway on a Saturday night type of punter, who coincidentally are the ones most likely to be voting on the next government. Who will they look to for representation when none of the current parties in govt or opposition will heed their concerns at the dissolution of the general life to which they have become accustomed? Yes it will be the mythical but soon to be real spook/stook that we currently refer to as the far right but fuck we haven't seen anything yet is my guess on how this will pan out.

Saying all this I was outside work earlier having a fag and an Indian lad strolled up and shared a joint with me so it's not like I've issues with the lads and I agree the anger is misdirected, but it's worth considering why the anger exists at all and why people need a target that can be hit rather than the impervious machine that is the clanking wheels of government, bureaucracy and the legal system (hi Franz, welcome to Ireland!) and thus direct their anger in a rather scattergun approach at the (let's face it no different than you or I) immigrant contingent.

The tap needs turning off because the sink is full. This is what is seen and said around the campfire and apart from a few fuckin eejits, it isn't racism that's the issue, it's the practicality of the situation and I guarantee if the tap was turned off tomorrow that people would soon warm to the lads and would definitely get over their initial fears of Johnny foreigner being a rapist (yes I understand there have been issues but by percentage I doubt it's massively worse than our own lads over the years) and get to know them and blah blah blah happy ever after etc.

The whole thing could be sorted no bother is the killer for me with it all, it shouldn't be rocket science to run a functioning refugee and immigration service without stupid loopholes and easily head off the arguments being made on all sides but no, there has to be money in it for plenty of lads for the govt response to be this stupid/obstinate about the whole thing.

Honestly though, you'd have to see it to believe it. The pace of change is nuts to the extent that the polski boys are feeling put out over it and all.

Also the point that the protests are being organised by the local shitehawks is not lost on me at all but you'd have to ask yourselves why the opinion of the local shitehawks is now gaining credence among those who would previously have written them off on sight?

Policy.

[hellfire]

The problem isn't the protests, it's who the protests are directed at (the migrants themselves) as well as the message (seems to be a lot of focus on scaremongering about foreigners, rather than the real problem being housing).

And as I said months ago when a protest happened in my area, where have all of these self-appointed defenders of the community been the last 40 year while local drug gangs have been destroying the place.

Pointing that out isn't defending the goverment, sure they love the fact there's a scapegoat to take the focus off of them, these protesters don't even realise they're doing exactly what the government want them to do.

The government in no way want these protests. Ideally this all could be handled by the political process if it hadn't shut up shop. None of this was being dealt with in any way until there were visible public disruptions. The morality and motivations of some of the protestors may be questionable, so what? In a lot of ways my even wasting bytes writing is useless. One of two things will happen. They keep importing at pace until such time as the 63% of people not wanting more becomes 93% or they implement some policies to cut the overall number of arrivals.

[Black Shepherd Carnage]

Why wouldn't they want these protests? Are you blind to the state of them?? They want as many thicks to be mouthing off and acting up at them as possible, and boy are they getting that. The more the protests get associated with a handful of individuals the average Irish person would never want moving in beside them either, the better. The folk in Inch were dead right to say they didn't want anyone from outside the community joining them. Unfortunately for them, they weren't heeded by the likes of Philip Dwyer. And seems like the same happened in Corofin re yer man getting hit with a torch, and same all over. The optics of the protests as they stand are absolutely perfect for the government. You've numbers for how many think too many migrants are being allowed in, grand. Have you numbers for how many think protesting accommodation centres and groups of migrant individuals is okay?

[Black Shepherd Carnage]

That's why I don't understand why ye think the gardai now coming out and pinning the blame on just such a handful of individuals is a play against ye. Fair enough the thing about criminals doing it with a view to keeping garda presence low seems a stretch, but the bottom line of the statement, as I read it, was "the majority have legitimate concerns, the handful of clowns don't."

[hellfire]

I'm not going to spend page after page meandering with you. I don't need to. These protests won't cease until the matter is handled politically and some faith is restored in the immigration system. Philip Dwyer represents a minority of people who completely overestimate their importance in all this. You and others like you are only happy to acknowledge legitimate concerns when it suits. The party is over for the radical left in this country. 

[Black Shepherd Carnage]

Radical left being PBP? Last polls were a month ago. SF were at 37%, another all time high. So if SF are the radical left in your eyes, I'd say there's still everything to play for. But sure, only the election will tell for certain.

Btw, I wasn't acknowledging legitimate concerns, since I still think those concerns are misdirected. I was just underlining that the gardai were acknowledging legitimate concerns.

[hellfire]

People Before Profit being the political arm of it. I was more referring to Antifa and other assorted freaks. They have had their day in the sun regarding deciding what others can do. A Sinn Fein government is an inevitability at this point. They are like a dog with it's teeth pulled.

[91/30]

Sinn Fein is so eager for power they'll do anything or say anything. I'd say they stand for less that even De Valera when he made the same grab for power in 1927. 

[Caomhaoin]

Complete sell-outs. It's a political inevitability that positions are loosened and policy diluted when mass appeal is achieved but these cunts are going above and beyond.

All that aside, could they possibly be worse than the current crowd? Things will certainly get 'woker', no doubt about that.

[Black Shepherd Carnage]

I know it was a figure of speech, but if we take the "standards" of FF and FG and the Green Party as the bar, then I think any compromises SF have engaged in so far fall well short of "above and beyond" that. I haven't been following closely, but from what I've seen they're really getting it from all angles recently, with little positive support in the Irish media even for things like their most recent win up north.

[ldj]

How have 'radical left' parties had their day, the entire history of the modern republic has been led by a right of center government and they've ran it into the ground.

I find the super woke/pc stuff as annoying as anyone else but that isn't the reason our country is a shambles, FF/FG and their neo-liberal policies are.

[hellfire]

I wasn't referring to parties apart from PBP.

[91/30]

I wasn't referring to parties apart from PBP.

Their real name before they changed it is the Socialist Workers Party, the crowd in Ireland are the local franchise of an English organisation. Total fantacists.  Do they have MPs back in their country of origin?  Don't know but doubt it.  As they're very 'agin the government' some goms in Ireland have voted for them