The Donald vs Big Tech

[astfgyl]

Where would you suggest I start my research?

There are so many dimensions to it, some purely about profit, others about social control. The first is more easily demonstrated, for the latter you're talking about deep sociological and political analyses. But this is pretty evident:
https://www.prisonpolicy.org/prisonindex/prisonlabor.html

The documentary I posted back a bit '13th' is worth a look (in full on YouTube) Follow up any claims you find doubtful.

Reading that there. Interesting stuff, but I was aware of the private prisons being used as a form of slavery already. Do you think the black communities would be appeased if the percentage of whites in the private prisons was adjusted to fit the percentage of citizens?

I think that the whole idea of private prisons existing at all is an affront to human rights and is simply a legal way of circumventing the abolishment of slavery. Maybe if the protests were to focus on more specific outcomes it would indeed bring about some welcome change, rather than "fuck all cops and authorities, we are going to smash these cities". It would certainly be more effective than spinning the wheel of racism around on the white majority and less abhorrent to me than watching sad white bastards washing black people's feet, which entirely misses the point. If those pastors were truly christians, there is a case to be made (by me on my own, probably) that they should have reciprocated the act or refused it, as pride is a sin as far as I remember from my knowledge of christianity.

I feel like you have been attempting to justify the violent nature of the protests by providing evidence of the systemic racism at play in the US. I don't in any way refute the idea that change is needed and that the black communities have been extremely hard done by, both historically and presently but there is no justification for an eye for an eye, and no justification for becoming the embodiment of the racism they so revile. I still believe that whatever the historic causes, the issue right now is more about the gap between rich and poor and a lot of it could be sorted with things like UBI, which would sidestep the issue of the funding of schools and lots of other issues which serve to exacerbate the issues of social deprivation. Any thoughts on any possible solutions yourself, rather than proving the justification for the discontent. Not in any way saying that the discontent is not justified by the way, but just to get the discussion going in less of a left vs right or black vs right direction and interested to know what anyone thinks around how it might be solved. I personally like the idea of UBI and certainly the abolishment of private prison ownership.

[mugz]

Where would you suggest I start my research?

There are so many dimensions to it, some purely about profit, others about social control. The first is more easily demonstrated, for the latter you're talking about deep sociological and political analyses. But this is pretty evident:
https://www.prisonpolicy.org/prisonindex/prisonlabor.html

The documentary I posted back a bit '13th' is worth a look (in full on YouTube) Follow up any claims you find doubtful.

Reading that there. Interesting stuff, but I was aware of the private prisons being used as a form of slavery already. Do you think the black communities would be appeased if the percentage of whites in the private prisons was adjusted to fit the percentage of citizens?

I think that the whole idea of private prisons existing at all is an affront to human rights and is simply a legal way of circumventing the abolishment of slavery. Maybe if the protests were to focus on more specific outcomes it would indeed bring about some welcome change, rather than "fuck all cops and authorities, we are going to smash these cities". It would certainly be more effective than spinning the wheel of racism around on the white majority and less abhorrent to me than watching sad white bastards washing black people's feet, which entirely misses the point. If those pastors were truly christians, there is a case to be made (by me on my own, probably) that they should have reciprocated the act or refused it, as pride is a sin as far as I remember from my knowledge of christianity.

I feel like you have been attempting to justify the violent nature of the protests by providing evidence of the systemic racism at play in the US. I don't in any way refute the idea that change is needed and that the black communities have been extremely hard done by, both historically and presently but there is no justification for an eye for an eye, and no justification for becoming the embodiment of the racism they so revile. I still believe that whatever the historic causes, the issue right now is more about the gap between rich and poor and a lot of it could be sorted with things like UBI, which would sidestep the issue of the funding of schools and lots of other issues which serve to exacerbate the issues of social deprivation. Any thoughts on any possible solutions yourself, rather than proving the justification for the discontent. Not in any way saying that the discontent is not justified by the way, but just to get the discussion going in less of a left vs right or black vs right direction and interested to know what anyone thinks around how it might be solved. I personally like the idea of UBI and certainly the abolishment of private prison ownership.

I highly doubt they're genuinely defunding the police, I mean apart from  guns and coffee shops we haven't had a real economy for decades. Without the state to employ people, we'll all be out protesting just for something to do.

[astfgyl]

I would protest if I believed in things...

[hellfire]

Looking at some of the numbers you sent.

Minimum wage in the US $5.15 per hour. Times forty and then 52 that amounts to $10,712
Average hourly earnings of a non-prisoner U.S. worker in a textile mil $10.95 per hour. Times 40 and then 52 comes to $22,776

To get a non prisoner to make clothes costs between $10,712 and $22,776 assuming a forty hour working week.

I'm not going to bother counting the prisoner wages, they are essentially a pittance.

The average cost of keeping someone in prison for a year is between 30k and 70k (Supermax and such cost  on the higher end) . Some states do it cheaper and others more expensive. That is the average cost of incarceration and doesn't take into account the cost of trying them, appeals and other legal issues. Pretty sure there a far more inmates without jobs than with them also.

I will still watch the documentary

[astfgyl]

the cost of trying them is minimal because of the plea bargain setup?

[hellfire]

Depends on the case. I'm sure a lot of them resist being incarcerated. Don't have numbers for that. Public defenders probably don't cost the same as paid attorneys, they do cost though. Death penalty cases costs are into the millions.

I was led to believe that the prison population size was due to the failed "war on drugs"

[astfgyl]

It's a fucked up place really. Pure "lets not go to Camelot" stuff.

Aren't private prisons a mad idea to be allowed happen though? I wonder how much a lifer is worth to them, must try find out

[hellfire]

I said it earlier. At best they are a stupid idea and at worst outright cruel.

[mugz]

It's a fucked up place really. Pure "lets not go to Camelot" stuff.

Aren't private prisons a mad idea to be allowed happen though? I wonder how much a lifer is worth to them, must try find out

it's just a metaphor for our incarnations here, or something like that

[mugz]

I would protest if I believed in things...

I believe in you, to an extent

[astfgyl]

I'll take "to an extent", sound Mugz

I said it earlier. At best they are a stupid idea and at worst outright cruel.

Agree with that. I'd go for the mixture of stupid and outright cruel when it comes to those privare prisons. The fact that they exist is an affront to lots of things.

[mugz]

I'll take "to an extent", sound Mugz

I said it earlier. At best they are a stupid idea and at worst outright cruel.

Agree with that. I'd go for the mixture of stupid and outright cruel when it comes to those privare prisons. The fact that they exist is an affront to lots of things.

if we got rid of stupidity and cruelty there'd be nothing left

[hellfire]

Master/slave is commonly used to describe one computer controlling another.  Just seen that ZFS (a killer filesystem) removed all reference to the word slave. I have no objection to it really. Client is interchangeable with the word slave.  Changing the comments on source code just seems unnecessary.

[Giggles]

if we got rid of stupidity and cruelty there'd be nothing left

You could do with swapping your mugz for hugz ya miserable wee fanny.

[Black Shepherd Carnage]

Since someone will prob think it, I have no problem with getting prisoners to do work. But using prison labor to fund a bloated, corrupt, injust mass incarceration system that serves political interests, not so much.

UNICOR employed almost 17,000 inmates in the 2017 fiscal year. The corporation sold $453.8 million in goods including clothing and textiles, office furniture and electronics during the same period. Almost 4,500 prisoners working for UNICOR in states from Colorado to New Jersey contributed to the clothing and textiles program, which sold over $126 million in products.

Washington state's correctional industries website notes that each $1 investment yields $12.68 in return to society.

https://www.newsweek.com/prison-slavery-who-benefits-cheap-inmate-labor-1093729

Plenty of info to be found.