The PC and Perpetually Offended Brigade

[Kurt Cocaine]

Most trannys would eventually be wireless. No?

[Emphyrio]

 

[Kurt Cocaine]

I'm here all week folks. Stay 'tuned'.... 

[Pedrito]

It's odd that the woman whose books probably did more to engender and foster this generation's obsession with a primitive view of good vs evil, social justice and identity politics is now feeling the repercussions of that which she released into the world. I don't see anything wrong with what she's saying, though I can see how the way she's saying it will prove offensive in certain quarters. That said  it doesn't take much to get them lunatics up in arms about anything anyway.

There's a narrative at the moment that masculinity is under attack, though I would argue the opposite. Fenininity is what is under attack from all fronts. The dehumanising influence of porn, the expectation that women should be all things a man is and on top of that be mothers, lovers, amazing wives etc etc. Women are portrayed as these incredibly violent, capable sex objects in Hollywood movies, kicking 20 men's heads in at a time.

Then we have this, for want of a better word, 'assault' on what a woman actually is. It's not good enough to strip them and make them feel bad about how they look, how they perform in bed, how they dress, their 'emotions', but now, having fought for equality for so long, they are now told that pfff none of that matters anyway because anyone can be a woman. Everything that makes you a woman is just a feeling that myself or Caomhaoin or Black Shepherd can have, and just by deciding or feeling like I'm a woman I'm immediately allowed to be a woman.

I have no problem AT ALL with someone wanting to change sex when they're an adult..more power to them, but what is happening now is a kind of militant attack on the idea of femininity and also on womanhood itself. It's no surprise that a lot of it comes from a leftist mindset, man is just material, no spirituality, no meaning to anything, mechanisms, cogs in the machine to be changed and replaced for the collective good.

I also wouldn't be of some opposite right mindset, women in the kitchen all that horseshit before some twat starts saying that. Ideologies on all sides are an afront on what it is to be human, to be a person with feelings, nuanced, intelligent. There is room for everyone. Black, white, trans, whatever, but trying to ram stuff down people's throats is not the way. If you feel strongly about trans stuff well fair play but attacking people, silencing them etc, ESPECIALLY people who fought for women's lib, gay rights etc. is just so fucking counter productive.

[Black Shepherd Carnage]

Then we have this, for want of a better word, 'assault' on what a woman actually is. It's not good enough to strip them and make them feel bad about how they look, how they perform in bed, how they dress, their 'emotions', but now, having fought for equality for so long, they are now told that pfff none of that matters anyway because anyone can be a woman.

I get this. Except, in the matter at hand, we're dealing with the opposite case; people born women (i.e. people who menstruate) who identify as men. It seems to me that the possibility to account for nuance is the primary victim in all of these topics.

You can't just alternate between one gender and another, unless you have found a way to change chromosomal make-up

And you can roll things like this out all you wish, like as if you actually have any level of experise in the field...but I'm sure we'd all find it very entertaining if you were to try explain all the various syndromes of sexual chromosome anomalies that exist; there's around a dozen of them. Taken all together, more than 1 in 500 births are concerned. These people have more options open to them today, more counselling, more of everything that makes it easier for them to grapple with their biological reality. Sure, things can get out of hand with the PC crowd, and they get hysterical and whatever, but jesus, there is also pure unadulterated ignorance on the other hand which we're still struggling to crawl out of as a society.

[Eoin McLove]

People who menstruate 

Genius.

[Eoin McLove]

Thankfully this nuttiness doesn't seem to be catching on to a great degree in Ireland,  or at least I'm utterly oblivious to it if it is which is good enough for me.

Pedrito nailed it there with his common sense,  or at least,  that's the stance I'd take on it too.  I get what BSC is saying above but I think that the current shift in attitude toward general acceptance of alternative lifestyles and the support available to people who suffer from these challenges show that the war is largely won for them. 

For the ultra PC heads to continue to rage on in their loony language wars is where it all starts getting kind of meaningless to me. There is an element of control around their constant mangling of the language,  twisting meaning into unrecognizable shapes and attempts to dominate and murder every narrative that is simply irritating as Hell. 

But is it all just online hot air? I dunno.

[Pedrito]

Then we have this, for want of a better word, 'assault' on what a woman actually is. It's not good enough to strip them and make them feel bad about how they look, how they perform in bed, how they dress, their 'emotions', but now, having fought for equality for so long, they are now told that pfff none of that matters anyway because anyone can be a woman.

I get this. Except, in the matter at hand, we're dealing with the opposite case; people born women (i.e. people who menstruate) who identify as men. It seems to me that the possibility to account for nuance is the primary victim in all of these topics.

The same would apply in the opposite sense too and there´ s plenty of room for nuance, we live in socities that allow these debates to happen, in fact one could argue that the issue gets far more airtime and far more media dedicated to it than other more pressing issues. In terms of nuance, that also would have applied in the other thread about BLM too, but ideologies take over as usual, in terms of what I was arguing: 2 wrongs don´  t make a right. There´  s no problem changing your sex, fire ahead, it´  s surgery. Again, though, the `  feeling´   that you´  re a man or woman is quite simply not something that can be quantified. It´  s like the `  feeling´   I get that people are discriminating against me. That´  s when you look at things like laws or science or god forbid biology, or the statisctics that you brought up relating to African Americans in jail. There´  s a movement towards transgenderism, it´  s a big topic of discussion today, will it be the same in 100 years? These are all perfectly relevant questions. Personally, as I said, I really don´  t care, I think I have an issue more with the way things are argued than anything else. Once these issues get sucked into the ideological, political realm, they´ re used as sticks to beat the enemy with and the claims and counterclaims start to get absolutely ridiculous. 

[Caomhaoin]

Deleted, no more of this back and forth.

Impulse control, Caomhaoin!

[Pedrito]

Thankfully this nuttiness doesn't seem to be catching on to a great degree in Ireland,  or at least I'm utterly oblivious to it if it is which is good enough for me.

Pedrito nailed it there with his common sense,  or at least,  that's the stance I'd take on it too.  I get what BSC is saying above but I think that the current shift in attitude toward general acceptance of alternative lifestyles and the support available to people who suffer from these challenges show that the war is largely won for them. 

For the ultra PC heads to continue to rage on in their loony language wars is where it all starts getting kind of meaningless to me. There is an element of control around their constant mangling of the language,  twisting meaning into unrecognizable shapes and attempts to dominate and murder every narrative that is simply irritating as Hell. 

But is it all just online hot air? I dunno.

I ` heart´   you too 

We need that Care emoji from Facebook, maybe Abbath holding a heart instead of an axe? Maybe a transgender Abbath..fuck it I´  m open to anything.   

[DeletedUsermNqGIiIuGy]

.fuck it I´  m open to anything.

Bleedin SLUH

[Pedrito]

Scahleh!

[astfgyl]

Deleted, no more of this back and forth.

Impulse control, Caomhaoin!

Ah fuck and I was just about to quote you. Regarding the both sets of genitalia, there is one in the town where I live. Looks like a man, dresses like a woman. There are around 8000 people in the town so statistically, 1 in 8000 has this issue. ;-)

I think Pedrito speaks the most sense here on this one. Live and let live, and don't find nitpicky ways to attack people online, trying to foster a sense of discontent or victimisation by picking at the subtle nuances of the language used. Not everybody has to agree with everything just because it is seen as PC, and this is why I find the far left as abhorrent as the far right. Everything has to be taken to the extreme all of the time, and all arguments online are inevitably dragged through the ditch of politics, race and gender these days.

It doesn't seem very clever to me to try to appear to be advocating harmony while attacking anybody who can be in the slightest way seen as a potential detractor.

[Eoin McLove]

Harmony is the last thing on the agenda of the far left and far right. Total mind control is the name of the game.

[Black Shepherd Carnage]

EDIT: Not going to quote Kev if he's deleted his post.

- I'm not an authority on sexual chromosome anomalies, but genetic engineering is part of my day to day, so I can understand papers on it when I read them.
- Down syndrome isn't an anomaly of the sexual chromosomes, I'm talking specifically of the dozen or so sexual chromosome anomalies. Taken all together, they account for about 1 in 500 births. Klinefelter syndrome is one, there are about a dozen others that have been discovered so far.
- The most important thing to bear in mind in dealing with gender is that gender transitioning is the rule. Two facts to blow you away: during embryonic development, we develop an arse before we develop a mouth, and for the first few weeks we all develop as females, in a X-chromosome dependent manner. In males, one gene (called SRY) on the Y-chromosome is activated about five/six weeks in to determine development of the male genitalia and prevent development of the female genitalia. If this activation didn't happen, we would all carry on developing as females. But, all sorts of things can go wrong here: you can have XY but SRY doesn't activate properly, XY but the Y is missing SRY, XX but with an either active or inactive SRY on one of the X, and other even more complex variants. Not to mention syndromes which are from anomalies in other genes than SRY; this is just the easiest case to explain, since it's central to the "normal" male development.

But even in the most chromosomally speaking "normal" cases, there are cascade effects the activation (in XY males) or non activation (in XX females) of SRY implies in the medulla and elsewhere in the brain where any number of things that we are not really close to understanding could be happening. So, for this reason, people who are specialists in that area, generally keep an open mind when it comes to how people identify sexually, since this is something intimately related also to communication between the genitalia (whatever they may be) and the brain, again things which we know a bit about, but frankly not very much. It's an extremely complex issue that we're only just beginning to study properly. For example, some say there's a higher incidence of genital dysphoria in people with Klinefelter, but there haven't been enough cases to really conclude one way or the other.

In short, this is absolutely the opposite of anti-science political whatever. This is science saying, "Look, this is way more complicated than we thought, so if someone is saying they feel like a certain gender, then maybe there's a biological cause we can find, but if we can't then maybe there's a neurobiological cause we don't even know how to look for. If it's the second case, then there's nothing we can say about it, so you'll have to deal with it as a society." And that is exactly what we have to do, with a minimum of hysteria and scare-mongering, preferably.