Songwriting / Inspiration

[Collie45]

Ok so forgive me in advance if this one goes on a bit, but I'd like people's advice on how to write and put together song ideas as best as possible?7

Generally what  I do is if I come up with a riff or a few chords or something I record it on the phone voice recorder before I forget it and then try to stitch a few similar ideas together.

I have been playing guitar since my teens in originals and covers bands yet despite this I am a very poor writer of songs.

It's not writers block so much as can't seem to get anything to come out properly. However, I have no problem in learning other people's songs quickly.

If I am at band practice (remember that? It used to be fun!) and one of the lads shows me a riff or an idea I'll have it picked up in no time - but, I struggle to come up with my own material.

I've recently started taking guitar lessons on Zoom again in the hope that this will give me a kick up the arse and/or get the old synapses firing, and I've been reading up on music theory. As well as guitar I play bass and know a few chords on a piano too so trying to broaden the horizons a bit.

Any advice would be welcome

[Eoin McLove]

If you find that all your riffs are sounding similar and following the same patterns, like generally mucking around in E- minor and F, start off by fucking around at the opposite end of the neck. Sometimes physically forcing your hands to move on uncomfortable ways,  deviating from the usual comfortable routine can either result in something unexpected emerging or even just jolt your brain into a more creative space.

Often I will be forcing something a bit odd and honing it for a while and then jump to a completely different thing that sounds great. The original idea is lost but I end up having a riff I like. It's as if I'm shaking my brain into the space it needs to be in for riffs to come out.

Might be worth a shot.

[Emphyrio]

Red wine.

Or if you come up with a riff/melody on guitar, transfer it to piano/synths and try come up with something different on guitar then.

A basic but fully functional recording set-up is recommended too. Can be done for very cheap nowadays. Very easy to mess around with instruments and layers.

Or, red wine.

[ochoill]

Red wine.

Or if you come up with a riff/melody on guitar, transfer it to piano/synths and try come up with something different on guitar then.

A basic but fully functional recording set-up is recommended too. Can be done for very cheap nowadays. Very easy to mess around with instruments and layers.

Or, red wine.

Both of these, really.  Move the ideas you have around a bit on other instruments to help open the ideas out.  Record on a small set up, laptop and interface with cheap monitors will do wonders.  This will help yoi get creative with structures too as you can cut and paste your songs into unusual shapes, then rewrite them after.  Pick up a bass and lay that down, and force yourself to record total counterpoint guitar over it.

If you find that all your riffs are sounding similar and following the same patterns, like generally mucking around in E- minor and F, start off by fucking around at the opposite end of the neck. Sometimes physically forcing your hands to move on uncomfortable ways,  deviating from the usual comfortable routine can either result in something unexpected emerging or even just jolt your brain into a more creative space.

"Your hands are like dogs, going to the same places they've been. You have to be careful when playing is no longer in the mind but in the fingers, going to happy places. You have to break them of their habits or you don't explore; you only play what is confident and pleasing. I'm learning to break those habits by playing instruments I know absolutely nothing about" - Tom Waits.

But also this entirely, pick up a book of shapes and scales and force yourself out of your comfort zone.  It will come back naturally but the new ideas you explore can be incorporated into what you are comfortable with.  I'll recommend the Guitarists Grimoire for anyone, it is absolutely class and has dug me out of a few musical ruts.

Use your phone and note/hum riffs and ideas into it when you're out and about.  Coming up with music away from where you are comfortable doing it will help.  Also look at songs you like, and break them down a bit.  Get a notepad out, write down what os happening in each part in your own way, not necessarily musically correct but to get a feel for visualising how you like a song to move.

Also - write three complimentary riffs, and pop structure them.  Intro/Verse/Chorus/Verse/Chorus/Bridge/Chorus/Outro.  Flesh it out a bit, double and half sections, change key, change arrangements, write variations and put them in between, drop parts entirely.  The point here being you work off a simple root and improve from there.

[Trev]

Use your phone and note/hum riffs and ideas into it when you're out and about.  Coming up with music away from where you are comfortable doing it will help.  Also look at songs you like, and break them down a bit.  Get a notepad out, write down what os happening in each part in your own way, not necessarily musically correct but to get a feel for visualising how you like a song to move.

Definitely this, there's a YouTube lad called Signals Music Studio who does a lot of great stuff on songwriting. He's got one video on Fade to Black where he breaks it down, goes through the keys, chords, arpeggios etc but shows how to apply this to coming up with your own stuff

https://youtu.be/1z4p0AFQnGo

[Emphyrio]

Also - write three complimentary riffs, and pop structure them.  Intro/Verse/Chorus/Verse/Chorus/Bridge/Chorus/Outro.  Flesh it out a bit, double and half sections, change key, change arrangements, write variations and put them in between, drop parts entirely.  The point here being you work off a simple root and improve from there.

Wisdom.

[Collie45]

If you find that all your riffs are sounding similar and following the same patterns, like generally mucking around in E- minor and F, start off by fucking around at the opposite end of the neck. Sometimes physically forcing your hands to move on uncomfortable ways,  deviating from the usual comfortable routine can either result in something unexpected emerging or even just jolt your brain into a more creative space.

Often I will be forcing something a bit odd and honing it for a while and then jump to a completely different thing that sounds great. The original idea is lost but I end up having a riff I like. It's as if I'm shaking my brain into the space it needs to be in for riffs to come out.

Might be worth a shot.

Exactly yeah am gonna try more of this to get out of the "comfort zone" or the well  - worn paths one's hands like to travel on the guitar neck.

[Kurt Cocaine]

You looking for a singer?

https://forum.metalwarfare.com/index.php?topic=1488.0

[Collie45]

Red wine.

Or if you come up with a riff/melody on guitar, transfer it to piano/synths and try come up with something different on guitar then.

A basic but fully functional recording set-up is recommended too. Can be done for very cheap nowadays. Very easy to mess around with instruments and layers.

Or, red wine.

Definitely gonna invest in red wine!
Joking aside will try to transfer an idea from one instrument to another.

[Collie45]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JKm2hrh31BM

I found this tutorial very good as he gets you to think outside the box in terms of the normal scale patterns and so on.

[Collie45]

Both of these, really.  Move the ideas you have around a bit on other instruments to help open the ideas out.  Record on a small set up, laptop and interface with cheap monitors will do wonders.  This will help yoi get creative with structures too as you can cut and paste your songs into unusual shapes, then rewrite them after.  Pick up a bass and lay that down, and force yourself to record total counterpoint guitar over it.

Use your phone and note/hum riffs and ideas into it when you're out and about.  Coming up with music away from where you are comfortable doing it will help.  Also look at songs you like, and break them down a bit.  Get a notepad out, write down what os happening in each part in your own way, not necessarily musically correct but to get a feel for visualising how you like a song to move.

Definitely going to try this.

Also - write three complimentary riffs, and pop structure them.  Intro/Verse/Chorus/Verse/Chorus/Bridge/Chorus/Outro.  Flesh it out a bit, double and half sections, change key, change arrangements, write variations and put them in between, drop parts entirely.  The point here being you work off a simple root and improve from there.

This is a great idea have to try it

[CorkonianHunger]

There is no real way of doing it and I don't want to come across as some wizard but some ideas I had a few years back.

Sounds stupid, but take a typical song, nothing too complex, that you're looking to make, and essentially rip it off on paper. Write the sections/changes on paper, write a riff that resembles it, same tempo etc. Then when that's done completely invert it. Change the key, change the speed, make the beat half time or double time.  Add a solo or extend an intro etc. Swap a few sections. Suddenly you have something. If you don't like the riffs change them, but use your new layout as a template to fill in.
Eventually you don't have to do this, but its handy when you're stuck, and it's not like you'll even use said song.