I was listening to Ulver- "Bergtatt" and followed it up with Ved Buens Ende- "Written in Waters", following a bit of a Skoll thread. His bass playing is so creative and adds dimensions to whatever he appears on I would argue. His resume is ridiculous when you add to the two above mentioned his contributions across the various epochs of Arcturus. And yet, you never really hear him get mentioned in discussions about Norwegian BM. I am sure I've never read, heard or seen an interview with him so maybe I'll have to google that later to see if such a thing exists. He was also on the Fimbulwinter demo with the Dimmu Borgir dudes but I'm less familiar with that recording- another one that's been on the shopping list for a while now. The man seemed to have been at the heart of the early days of the Norwegian black metal movement but exists almost as a shadow. I think it's fair to say that his playing has massively influenced Gjendød, and that influence is one of their most lethal secret weapons in my onion. A secret legend?
Aspera Hiems Symfonia on in the car this afternoon and it's fair to say I agree with myself on this one, Skoll is a legend.
Seeing as nobody wants to play, I've opened up the topic to include any musicians who have remained almost in obscurity, have kept a low profile or are enigmatic despite having made valuable contributions to metal. Who deserves some praise?
You, Andy. Is that the right answer?
Oh stop!
Snorre Ruch from Thorns? His style of guitar playing was meant to be really influential on the 90s black metal scene.
Snorre is low profile but I think he is very much embedded in BM lore, particularly because of his involvement in Euronymous's murder, but also because his guitar playing was so influential on Mayhem. Skoll on the other hand barely seems to exist until you look at his resumé and realise just how many incredible albums he has been a part of. And his bass playing is a huge part of the sound of the records he appears on. He's a true enigma.
I had The Angel and the Dark River on earlier. What a fantastic album; simply perfectly realised. I think Rick Miah was such a force of creativity on the MDB albums he was on. His drumming was unique and always added to the songs with interesting patterns that often are as important as the riffs- the drum patterns often lodge in the brain a much as the melodies- but they never become so busy as to compromise the doomy vibe. I'm not sure how sung or unsung he may be but he deserves praise.
Vinny Appice maybe.
Listening to Bergtatt and Skoll's bass lines, particularly in Capitel III are so fucking cool. Simple but meandering. He's a legend, even if I'm on my own in seeing it ::)
It's only fair to give a nod to Lill Katherine Stensrud who provides wonderful vocals on this and Written in Waters, too. Those two albums appear to be all she was involved in. Not a bad little resume all the same.
I really need to get all the early Ulver stuff on CD so I can spend more time with it all. Superb stuff.
Speaking of cool bass playing, Fenriz (who???) put in a super performance on Kronet til Konge. Maybe I should change this thread again to make it about deadly bassists. No wait, that will completely put me out of the picture.
I just goggled black metal albums from 1995 and, wow, what a great year it was. I have quite a few of those releases already but there are a good handful more I need to add to the collection. Nice to see Imrama in the mix for that year.
Bass on KTK is incredible.
Whoever thought the day would come when Chris Holmes would be the rational voice of reason?
QuotePrior to launching into the Neil Young classic, Holmes told the crowd: "We're still killing each other. What the fuck? What the fuck's with that, man? I don't understand. It's stupid. It's stupid, man. All the shit.
"This song goes out to the all the people in Ukraine. I look at the shit and just think about if that was me living there, and that fucking cocksucker Putin... I'd love to get my hands on that fucker's neck, man, and shove something up his ass so fucking far... One man ruining this many people. It just makes me sick. Over what?
"We're gonna never get off this planet until we all join as one," he continued. "Or else we'll destroy it and the human race will never exist anymore. [It will] probably [be] two, three, four thousand years till we stop killing each other.
"But this next song goes out to all the people in Ukraine.
"I've been to the communist countries that were held down. It ain't cool."
Quote from: Eoin McLove on October 08, 2022, 05:32:13 AMI was listening to Ulver- "Bergtatt" and followed it up with Ved Buens Ende- "Written in Waters", following a bit of a Skoll thread. His bass playing is so creative and adds dimensions to whatever he appears on I would argue. His resume is ridiculous when you add to the two above mentioned his contributions across the various epochs of Arcturus. And yet, you never really hear him get mentioned in discussions about Norwegian BM. I am sure I've never read, heard or seen an interview with him so maybe I'll have to google that later to see if such a thing exists. He was also on the Fimbulwinter demo with the Dimmu Borgir dudes but I'm less familiar with that recording- another one that's been on the shopping list for a while now. The man seemed to have been at the heart of the early days of the Norwegian black metal movement but exists almost as a shadow. I think it's fair to say that his playing has massively influenced Gjendød, and that influence is one of their most lethal secret weapons in my onion. A secret legend?
Skoll rules! I'm sure there is a reasonable amount of f appreciation out there Andy. Have you listened to the Radical Research blogs?
VBE
https://radicalresearch.org/episode-53-its-all-gone-weird-the-ved-buens-ende-virus-a-b/
DHG
https://radicalresearch.org/episode-61-face-the-goat-at-sunrise-dodheimsgard-1995-2015/
And bizarrely...
https://radicalresearch.org/episode-89-bassically-metal-bass-guitar-solos-that-rip-ass/
Haven't looked at those but I'll get on it. Cheers Danny 8)
I think in terms of the inner circle, or those close to it, Skoll has never come on my radar. His work is really unique but he seems to maintain a very low profile.
Radical research is a great podcast, for all types of weirdo proggy spectrum of the genre.
Mekong Delta, Death Row, Paul Chain, Master's Hammer, Beyond Dawn, In The Woods, Fleurety... it's a veritable treasure trove of everything oddball!
I was listening to World Coming Down in recent days and it occurred to me that Kenny Hicky deserves a place in this thread. He's hardly enigmatic from a fan's point of view, but I think for any man to have the sheer fucking balls to sing alongside Pete Steele they deserve a huge amount of credit. He does well and his contributions are integral to the overall Type O experience, but when his vocal parts end and Steele comes back in, the depth and power of Steele's voice just take things to entirely new dimensions. Full marks to Hicky for having the neck or bloody minded foolhardiness or delusional ego to step up to the mic next to Steele! 8)
Hickey has a great set of pipes. His latest project with Kirk from Crowbar has him on lead vocals. He's an underrated guitarist too.
He's a talented dude no doubt about it, but I can't think of many or any singers within metal who could match ol' Pete for power.
These were underrated after being classed as 'Christian Metal', but despite it all made top quality progressive thrash.
Quote from: Eoin McLove on November 04, 2023, 03:19:04 AMI was listening to World Coming Down in recent days and it occurred to me that Kenny Hicky deserves a place in this thread. He's hardly enigmatic from a fan's point of view, but I think for any man to have the sheer fucking balls to sing alongside Pete Steele they deserve a huge amount of credit. He does well and his contributions are integral to the overall Type O experience, but when his vocal parts end and Steele comes back in, the depth and power of Steele's voice just take things to entirely new dimensions. Full marks to Hicky for having the neck or bloody minded foolhardiness or delusional ego to step up to the mic next to Steele! 8)
Yeah he's essential but sort of overlooked a lot. Class musician. Both his vocals and guitar are excellent counterpoints to Steele's bass and vocals. Some great examples of what you're saying too all over the catalog, a favourite being when Hickey's parts end on All Hallow's Eve, the Chorus shifts gears and Steele lets off that "sssssaint Lucifer..." - top class.
Mike Clark. Most people talk about Rocky George when they refer to Suicidal Tendencies but Clarks right hand came up with most of STs most memorable riffs and he was an integral part of their peak sound. Granted he stuck around while they had turned to shit but for the most part he was a very positive presence
Eric Adams probably doesn't get the praise he deserves, his vocals are every bit as good as your Dio's, Dickinson's, or Halfords, and he's still sounding great in his 70s.
Guess it doesn't help that he's been in a band most people think is a bit of joke the last 30 odd years, and he's never done anything outside of Manowar which is a real shame
Quote from: The Great Cull on November 06, 2023, 02:46:18 PMMike Clark. Most people talk about Rocky George when they refer to Suicidal Tendencies but Clarks right hand came up with most of STs most memorable riffs and he was an integral part of their peak sound. Granted he stuck around while they had turned to shit but for the most part he was a very positive presence
Legend. Mark Dodson, the producer, said he was one of the tightest players he ever worked with.
Quote from: ochoill on November 06, 2023, 01:52:46 PMQuote from: Eoin McLove on November 04, 2023, 03:19:04 AMI was listening to World Coming Down in recent days and it occurred to me that Kenny Hicky deserves a place in this thread. He's hardly enigmatic from a fan's point of view, but I think for any man to have the sheer fucking balls to sing alongside Pete Steele they deserve a huge amount of credit. He does well and his contributions are integral to the overall Type O experience, but when his vocal parts end and Steele comes back in, the depth and power of Steele's voice just take things to entirely new dimensions. Full marks to Hicky for having the neck or bloody minded foolhardiness or delusional ego to step up to the mic next to Steele! 8)
Yeah he's essential but sort of overlooked a lot. Class musician. Both his vocals and guitar are excellent counterpoints to Steele's bass and vocals. Some great examples of what you're saying too all over the catalog, a favourite being when Hickey's parts end on All Hallow's Eve, the Chorus shifts gears and Steele lets off that "sssssaint Lucifer..." - top class.
That we actually the exact part that inspired my post.
What about Fabian Wyrsch, the drummer from Bölzer? He maintains quite a low profile allowing Okoi to do most of the interviews. Most people when discussing Bölzer talk about the love/hate vocals and the riffs- maybe the concepts and lyrics (and artwork) too, but Fabian's drumming seldom gets more than a mention. I think his drumming is as essential as all of the other elements in making the band sound the way it does. From what I gather he is not a huge underground metal freak like Okoi is, but more of a classic rock guy. His drumming is super powerful and solid with an often tribal nature to the use of toms and adds thickness to the songs, filling in much of the space left absent by the bass void. His patterns are often quite primal or naive in the way they mirror the riffs, but if you had a more typical metal drummer shredding the kit the power would possibly be wiped out of the music.
I only caught bolzer live for the first time during the summer!,his drumming is something else alright!
Stephen Flynn, Atheist's drummer, wipes the floor with most of the "big" names in the genre, yet you never hear a peep about him.
He's a pretty nifty guitarist too.
Similarly, Steve Asheim from Deicide rarely gets due credit.
While on the drummer topic and despite what members of LOA and Type O Negative would say, Sal Abruscato brought a unique groove to both bands. Neither band managed to capture anything close once he was gone. This has been proven twice with LOA.
I could never get into Life Of Agony, I liked River Runs Red musically but the vocals were appalling IMO. They seemed to go in an alt rock direction after that from what I've heard and the vocals changed, but it wasn't my thing.
Savage drummer alright though, groove would be the right word to apply to his style.
I'd be up for the first 2 LOA albums and some of the third but after that I was never arsed at all
Life of Agony are one of the most overrated bands to ever exist, and your man/wan Caputo is some description of whiny bollocks.
Quote from: Ducky on November 23, 2023, 08:41:57 PMLife of Agony are one of the most overrated bands to ever exist, and your man/wan Caputo is some description of whiny bollocks.
Nah man, first 2 are well decent albums if you can get over the vocals
After that.. ah well pity he got his mickey cut off and all but the music got worse is the main takeaway
Quote from: astfgyl on November 24, 2023, 12:29:28 AMQuote from: Ducky on November 23, 2023, 08:41:57 PMLife of Agony are one of the most overrated bands to ever exist, and your man/wan Caputo is some description of whiny bollocks.
Nah man, first 2 are well decent albums if you can get over the vocals
After that.. ah well pity he got his mickey cut off and all but the music got worse is the main takeaway
Yiz reckon? I found the music to be a bit generic metal-by-numbers. And he's such a whiny cunt it's hard to get past that :laugh:
I liked the last three songs from Ugly (including the Simple Minds cover). Abruscato's drumming is the highlight of the band.
I can see why you wouldn't like the vocals to be fair, they have a fairly distinct timbre to them. And given how many albums they have now since I liked one, I wouldn't go across the road to see them live or anything. Is Abruscato only on the first one anyway? He's class on it indeed but if it's him on the second one, I'm less impressed
Quote from: astfgyl on November 25, 2023, 11:31:53 PMI can see why you wouldn't like the vocals to be fair, they have a fairly distinct timbre to them. And given how many albums they have now since I liked one, I wouldn't go across the road to see them live or anything. Is Abruscato only on the first one anyway? He's class on it indeed but if it's him on the second one, I'm less impressed
I kinda like the vocals but oh man, the fucking lyrics are just cringe. And it's kinda hard to ignore them as they're cleanly sang, front and center.
My Google-fu says he's played on the debut, Ugly, Broken Valley, A Place Where Theres No More Pain.
Shit! He wasn't great on Ugly then, I was going round thinking it was the other lad on that. Can't even rememberhow name this minute but he's simply functional is how I'd describe his drumming. No personality.
Abruscato's generally great though, especially on Bloody Kisses his drumming really makes that album as much as the rest of it.
Listened to Broken Valley once and never went back to it and think I might have heard maybe two songs of anything else they have. Mad to think they had Whitfield Crane filling in at one stage too isn't it. I'd nearly be more interested to hear them do an album with him than Caputo at this stage and that's not to say I'd actually be interested at all and more to point out that they're really a nothing band now I think about it. They had the drumming and the Josh Silver production on the first album and Ugly isn't bad (although there are indeed some real toe curling lyrics on there too) but otherwise... nothing
I never too to Ugly like I did RRR.
Didn't they get in a couple of big names to produce and mix it? The end result just wasn't the same.
I think that's where they messed up.
Got big heads up on themselves after the first album made a decent sized splash.
They moved away from their hardcore sound towards a more rock orientated one. Some good songs. I loved Soul Searching Sun when it came out but I haven't listened to it in decades. I don't even seem to have the CD here anymore. Must have grown legs over the years but I'm not sure it's one I really need to replace. I thought Caputo's first solo album was a brilliant pop rock record. Some very odd lyrics here and there but a really beautiful album in places.
Quote from: Eoin McLove on November 26, 2023, 08:57:35 AMThey moved away from their hardcore sound towards a more rock orientated one. Some good songs. I loved Soul Searching Sun when it came out but I haven't listened to it in decades. I don't even seem to have the CD here anymore. Must have grown legs over the years but I'm not sure it's one I really need to replace. I thought Caputo's first solo album was a brilliant pop rock record. Some very odd lyrics here and there but a really beautiful album in places.
Yeah his solo album had some great songs on there. The odd lyrics do seem to point to his future "changes"
Quote from: The Great Cull on November 26, 2023, 09:42:21 AMQuote from: Eoin McLove on November 26, 2023, 08:57:35 AMThey moved away from their hardcore sound towards a more rock orientated one. Some good songs. I loved Soul Searching Sun when it came out but I haven't listened to it in decades. I don't even seem to have the CD here anymore. Must have grown legs over the years but I'm not sure it's one I really need to replace. I thought Caputo's first solo album was a brilliant pop rock record. Some very odd lyrics here and there but a really beautiful album in places.
Yeah his solo album had some great songs on there. The odd lyrics do seem to point to his future "changes"
Absolutely, yeah.
Yeah! Soul Searching Sun was quite good for the most part. Some pretty cool bonus tracks on the digi version.
Never checked out Capitol's solo stuff. Must go digging.
Razzberry Mockery is a great tune to start with
River Runs Red is a classic.
I thought Ugly was poor but Soul Searching Sun was a return to from.
Broken Valley had its moments. The vocals have always been hit and miss live. If seems like more effort goes into being edgy over hitting notes and staying in tune.
I'm clueless about the drama around the band. I know Caputo is now a chick but what's she saying on stage that's so annoying? Honest question.
It's not what's been said that's annoying. The vocals seem to suffer from there being more emphasis on the look at me factor rather than listen to me.
Their full set from Hellfest 2022 is on YouTube.
I'd still like to see them in a small venue to hear those big songs live.