It's a bit of a tangent so I thought best to move it away from the interesting discussion going on in the Best Thrash Album thread...
The albums which came towards the end of the Thrash years, that 88-93 period, when the fast bands slowed down a bit and branched out are, to me, some of the most interesting of their careers. Off the top of my head...
Death Angel - Act III
Slayer - South of Heaven
Anthrax - SOWN
Coroner - Mental Vortex & Grin
Kreator - Renewal
Overkill - The Years of Decay
Acid Reign - Obnoxious
Prong - Prove You Wrong
Voivod - Angel Rat & The Outer Limits
Testament - Low
There are others for whom it worked and others who didn't fare quite so well. Metallica's 90's efforts don't really work for me but I know plenty of people who rank those albums very highly. It was a great period for Metal, I reckon, before it all turned to shit.
Getting into Metal around 91/ 92, it felt like I had arrived a bit late to the party. Albums like The Ritual, Kin and Set The World On Fire promised much with their opening track's videos on Headbanger's Ball but delivered fuck all. Which was crushing when you're a young lad and a new tape was a big investment.
That being said Low was a career highlight for Testament. And if you had asked me at time, I would have said Chaos A.D. was Sepultura's best album.
Low was released in 94 chief. ;) Minor quibble aside it's a great album and one that is overlooked far too much.
Suicidal Tendencies are often lumped (incorrectly) with thrash bands when their 90s albums (Lights Camera... and Art Of Rebellion) had really shown how much they could stretch out.
Recording started in 93 :laugh:
I think he may have been pointing out that Low is Testaments best album,that it wasnt released at the height of the Thrash scene?.
Doesn't matter what he meant. What he is said is what counts. :laugh:
Quote from: Juggz on August 25, 2020, 06:23:37 PM
It's a bit of a tangent so I thought best to move it away from the interesting discussion going on in the Best Thrash Album thread...
The albums which came towards the end of the Thrash years, that 88-93 period, when the fast bands slowed down a bit and branched out are, to me, some of the most interesting of their careers. Off the top of my head...
Coroner - Mental Vortex & Grin
Not only is 'Grin' Coroner's best album - it's one of the best albums of all time. It's a very misunderstood recording
Testament's "Low" is utter scutter!
The albums you listed aren't bad by any means but they just do not measure up to they're earlier outputs. Eg I still spin RIB regularly whereas south of heaven would be brought out once a year.
I'd add Suicidal Tendencies - The Art of Rebellion to the list
Quote from: Ducky on August 25, 2020, 08:31:15 PM
Testament's "Low" is utter scutter!
I agree with this. I also never gave it a chance so I might throw it on today and see if I still hate it. This is the one without Skolnik yes?
Yeah, James Murphy plays lead.
Quote from: Anton Arcane on August 25, 2020, 07:45:07 PM
Getting into Metal around 91/ 92, it felt like I had arrived a bit late to the party. Albums like The Ritual, Kin and Set The World On Fire promised much with their opening track's videos on Headbanger's Ball but delivered fuck all. Which was crushing when you're a young lad and a new tape was a big investment.
That being said Low was a career highlight for Testament. And if you had asked me at time, I would have said Chaos A.D. was Sepultura's best album.
Yes you certainly missed the height of it - really after Master of Puppets metal exploded but was still an underground /countercultural phenomenon.
Every month seemed to bring an absolute classic from the years 87 til 90 even into 91. It's funny but the Black album and Puppets for me bookend this golden era.
There were still fantastic albums coming out in 92 and 93 and some great gigs too back then but already thrash had morphed, death metal bands seemed to be treading old ground and sounded samey.
Grunge was massive then too and then numetal fucked everything.
Quote from: Ducky on August 25, 2020, 08:31:15 PM
Testament's "Low" is utter scutter!
Yep, the ritual was a much better album.
Low would be one of the least rated testament albums
I don't listen to much Testament anymore but when I did Low and The Gathering were probably my most played by them.
Quote from: Juggz on August 25, 2020, 07:59:03 PM
Recording started in 93 :laugh:
Should have included 94 so we could throw in Youthanasia.... :D :D
Quote from: The Butcher on August 26, 2020, 12:21:24 PM
Quote from: Juggz on August 25, 2020, 07:59:03 PM
Recording started in 93 :laugh:
Should have included 94 so we could throw in Youthanasia.... :D :D
He does love that album :laugh:
Throw it in a fucking skip, I hope :laugh:
I'm surprised to see the backlash against Low. I'd rate as the best thing they did since The New Order quite comfortably. The Ritual is ok for something trying ever so hard to be the Black Album and Skolnick goes a long way to redeeming it with probably his finest ever playing. As for Practice and Souls... weak.
The first two Testament albums are head and shoulders above their other records. They've a few good songs per album, but they never recaptured that fire of the first two.
I think the three best of your list are South of Heaven, Renewal (it's just so fucking weird at times) and Mental Vortex (by a country mile, unreal album).
There's a question - seeing as I got into metal around 1998, anything before then was me just discovering music, often completely out of chronological order...
What was it like for ye boyos hearing these things as follow ups to sacred tomes like Reign in Blood? I like and still listen to South of Heaven, but I can imagine it being quite a shock being hyped for the follow up to RiB and this is what you got.
Quote from: Juggz on August 26, 2020, 12:35:59 PM
Throw it in a fucking skip, I hope :laugh:
I'm surprised to see the backlash against Low. I'd rate as the best thing they did since The New Order quite comfortably. The Ritual is ok for something trying ever so hard to be the Black Album and Skolnick goes a long way to redeeming it with probably his finest ever playing. As for Practice and Souls... weak.
Why do you consider those albums weak exactly?
Quote from: Ducky on August 26, 2020, 01:56:26 PM
There's a question - seeing as I got into metal around 1998, anything before then was me just discovering music, often completely out of chronological order...
What was it like for ye boyos hearing these things as follow ups to sacred tomes like Reign in Blood? I like and still listen to South of Heaven, but I can imagine it being quite a shock being hyped for the follow up to RiB and this is what you got.
No we were all blown away by South of Heaven in my group of friends. Slower yes but definitely more sinister.
I remember 7th Son causing a bigger shock, some lads loved it but a lot didn't.
With the likes of Beneath the Remains and Leprosy on the go Maiden were seen as old hat!
Low is one of Testaments finest hours. Far more aggressive than The Ritual (an album I've always viewed as Black Album-lite).
James Murphy was a welcome addition to replace Skolnick.
Demonic is the one that sucks major balls. The Gathering was a bit of a fluke though as everything else since has been weak as fuck.
Quote from: Cailleach on August 26, 2020, 02:03:19 PM
Why do you consider those albums weak exactly?
The songs are just poor, essentially, very few memorable riffs and their lyrics are little more than an effort at wedging syllables in and hoping it makes sense. The production on both is shocking, also. After posting that, I thought it had been a while since I listened to them and, yeah, I'm sticking to my guns there :laugh: The Ritual is better but it's so clearly an effort to ride the template of the Black Album and, again, a crap sound doesn't help. Skolnick is a fucking star on it, though. Credit where it's due. Low isn't perfect but it was an effort to do something other than copy Metallica, which was nice and there are some interesting riffs, great solos and their first album with a really good drummer.
Quote from: Ducky on August 26, 2020, 01:56:26 PM
There's a question - seeing as I got into metal around 1998, anything before then was me just discovering music, often completely out of chronological order...
What was it like for ye boyos hearing these things as follow ups to sacred tomes like Reign in Blood? I like and still listen to South of Heaven, but I can imagine it being quite a shock being hyped for the follow up to RiB and this is what you got.
I got into metal around 86/87 and it was
all new so hearing the likes of SOH was just... it's hard to say. All those bands changed with each album, back then. Slayer only started getting repetitive around Seasons, for me but, before that, they changed with every album so you kind of expected it to be different to the last one. I don't think anyone expected them to go faster than RIB :laugh: I would have fucking loved to have been in the position of knowing only SNM and HA before hearing RIB. That would have been fucking unreal but, when I got into them, RIB was already out and it was just part of all the new (to me) music I was getting from friends and buying in the Sound Cellar.
The one which stands out in my memory is when Human came out. I loved Leprosy and Spiritual Healing, was at the fake Death gig with Kreator, read the shit thrown Chuck's way in the magazines and then interviews with him coming back saying he had gotten the best musicians he could find as session guys for this new album and it was super aggressive and then waiting for it to be released... that first listen to Human on the bus on the way home from town having my mind blown. That was fucking cool. It was made cooler by the fact I bought Unquestionable Presence that day too on the basis that if the Cynic lads I had read about were good enough for Chuck, then I should check out one of them with Atheist too. That was a very memorable day :)
I heard all the then-released Slayer albums in this order: Show No Mercy, South Of Heaven, Hell Awaits, Live Undead & Reign In Blood - so I never considered SOH a follow-up to RIB, rather RIB was a warm-up for SOH. I still feel the same - I would't even put RIB in my top 3 Slayer albums, and SOH is head and shoulders above anything else they released, before or after.
AJFA was the 'new' Metallica album and, apart from the obvious lack of bass, among my group of metal fan friends it was just seen as another Metallica album, a bit more intricate in the song structure but no more remarkable that that. It slotted quite easily into their discography as far as we were concerned, with Kill 'Em All being the one that stood out.
Love this period in terms of metal. I'm completely obsessed with Death Angel: Act III going on quite a while now. The previous albums were great but, as Jugzz says, what an incredible shift to something so new and fresh. SOH a similar story. Just so 'on it's own' in terms of the Slayer discography. Both these albums as well as others mentioned above stand out for neither being thrash nor the Black album or grunge influenced metal that came subsequently. Amazing album.
Quote from: Pedrito on August 26, 2020, 04:03:36 PM
Love this period in terms of metal. I'm completely obsessed with Death Angel: Act III going on quite a while now. The previous albums were great but, as Jugzz says, what an incredible shift to something so new and fresh. SOH a similar story. Just so 'on it's own' in terms of the Slayer discography. Both these albums as well as others mentioned above stand out for neither being thrash nor the Black album or grunge influenced metal that came subsequently. Amazing album.
I remember when it came out, I was like "What the hell are they doing?" Then a couple of months later, and it just clicked. Still my favourite album of all time.
Quote from: ldj on August 26, 2020, 12:19:42 PM
I don't listen to much Testament anymore but when I did Low and The Gathering were probably my most played by them.
Their best two as far as im concerned.
Quote from: Mower Liberation Front on August 26, 2020, 04:37:23 PM
Quote from: Pedrito on August 26, 2020, 04:03:36 PM
Love this period in terms of metal. I'm completely obsessed with Death Angel: Act III going on quite a while now. The previous albums were great but, as Jugzz says, what an incredible shift to something so new and fresh. SOH a similar story. Just so 'on it's own' in terms of the Slayer discography. Both these albums as well as others mentioned above stand out for neither being thrash nor the Black album or grunge influenced metal that came subsequently. Amazing album.
I remember when it came out, I was like "What the hell are they doing?" Then a couple of months later, and it just clicked. Still my favourite album of all time.
SOH or Act III? Both amazing in fairness
Quote from: Pedrito on August 26, 2020, 08:18:12 PM
Quote from: Mower Liberation Front on August 26, 2020, 04:37:23 PM
Quote from: Pedrito on August 26, 2020, 04:03:36 PM
Love this period in terms of metal. I'm completely obsessed with Death Angel: Act III going on quite a while now. The previous albums were great but, as Jugzz says, what an incredible shift to something so new and fresh. SOH a similar story. Just so 'on it's own' in terms of the Slayer discography. Both these albums as well as others mentioned above stand out for neither being thrash nor the Black album or grunge influenced metal that came subsequently. Amazing album.
I remember when it came out, I was like "What the hell are they doing?" Then a couple of months later, and it just clicked. Still my favourite album of all time.
SOH or Act III? Both amazing in fairness
Act III.
Absolutely class album. The band that time forgot. Amazing talent, I find myself listening to them more and more with every passing year. The Art of Dying was an unreal comeback also.
One of the big "What ifs". How big could they had it not been for the bus crash? The Organisation was pretty good too.