I just noticed that Primordial haven't got their own dedicated thread. How did that happen, I wonder...
With 'Spirit the Earth Aflame' celebrating its 20th anniversary yesterday it seems as good a time as any to crank it up and dive into their back catalogue. I have it on here now with 'Storm Before Calm' lined up next but I might take this opportunity to revisit, and maybe reapraise, 'Redemption at the Puritan's Hand' and 'Where Greater Men Have Fallen', the two albums that never hit the spot for me.
There really only is one Primordial. They sound like nobody else, are instantly identifiable and at their best are emotionally stirring, dark, epic and all of those things we like. The interplay between the instruments, the trad influence that is so deeply embedded in the choice of chords and rhythms but that is often difficult to pin down precisely and Alan's divisive vocals, any of which, if removed, would compromise the bands identity.
So let's hash it out. Who likes, who loves and who hates!
Edit. 'Children of the Harvest'- Oof! What a song.
Children of the harvest is ace.
'The Gathering Wilderness' is my favourite, 'Spirit the Earth Aflame' coming in next. The last album was cool aswell. I've seen them live here in Madrid, but nothing compares to an album release show in Dublin.
I've always felt 'Storm before Calm' was a weak album, despite the lads themselves not getting the lukewarm response it got. 'Sons of the Morrigan' is a good track, but a tad pedestrian apart from that.
My favourite track is 'The Calling', absolute banger of a choon. Soft spot for 'beneath a bronze sky' too.
With age Primordial are growing on me. I wasnt a fan as a young whipper snapper, but have warmed to them as of late. I recently watched that documentary on them which was great, although Alan seems to speak over some of the boys throughout it. Babels Tower is a belter of song! Great live band too
I always hated this band.
Boring overlong songs that go nowhere and the vocalist is out of key half the time.
I remember getting one of their more recent albums and there was a song that just plays the same shit riff for about 3 mins before anything happens.
Gathering wilderness is proper shite as well.
No.
That said, I braved 'Where Greater Men Have Fallen' after the classic (yep) 'Storm Before Calm' this morning and it was as turgid and uninspired to my ears today as I remembered. A truly boring album. I pulled 'Redemption...' off the shelf too but I'm not sure if there's any real benefit to be reaped from revisiting that album today. The doldrum years.
Find it very hard to listen to the more recent material,but everything up tp Storm before Calm is top notch.
Id probably rate Storm as the best metal album to come out of ireland.
I'd be mostly familiar with The Gathering Wilderness and TTND which are both excellent, need to give the earlier stuff more time but I've enjoyed Spirit and Storm the times I've listened to them.
Really like 'Spirit The Earth Aflame', 'The Gathering Wilderness' and 'To The Nameless Dead'...
Listened to all of these quite a lot when they came out and occasionally throw them on still.
Nothing else held my attention enough to really went to revisit them again.
Quote from: ldj on May 23, 2020, 10:04:37 AM
I'd be mostly familiar with The Gathering Wilderness and TTND which are both excellent, need to give the earlier stuff more time but I've enjoyed Spirit and Storm the times I've listened to them.
If you're a vinyl person the Metal Blade reissues of those two albums are worth picking up.
I loved the demo at the time and liked Imrama, but I can't abide anything they've released since*. I hate Alan's voice TBH and find the music just... turgid, frankly.
Saw them live a few times back in the day, the last time was a launch gig downstairs in Fibber's, I think it was in '98/'99 (Alan, Darragh O'Laoghaire and Steve Hughes played old thrash covers as support) and I left after a couple of songs. I've never seen what the fuss was about, despite going back and reappraising them every 5 years or so since.
That Killing Joke style song off the last album wasn't too bad, all things considered.
*That's not to try and be all kvlt and nekro or any of that bollocks, I generally can't stand black metal, which is where they leaned at the time.
Quote from: Eoin McLove on May 23, 2020, 11:32:49 AM
Quote from: ldj on May 23, 2020, 10:04:37 AM
I'd be mostly familiar with The Gathering Wilderness and TTND which are both excellent, need to give the earlier stuff more time but I've enjoyed Spirit and Storm the times I've listened to them.
If you're a vinyl person the Metal Blade reissues of those two albums are worth picking up.
Cheers, I must look into them.
On a side note, I've always thought Metal Blade was an odd label for Primordial to be signed to, they have a history of classic metal but since the 2000's they seem to specialise more in tech death/core and the like.
Was looking up the Primordial discography on wikipedia and ended up on A.A's discography page. He is on a lot of albums. Is any of his other stuff any good?
Threw on track 1 of Where Greater Men Have Fallen there and couldn't get through it despite remembering thinking it was grand.
Definitely not their finest hour.
Blood Revolt released one album and is essentially Axis of Advance with Alan on vocals. It's savage.
"The Coffin Ships" is partially one of the finest songs in all of metal and I genuinely get goosebumps hearing the lyrics being belted out... just a pity about the widdly folk melodies that drone on for minutes and go nowhere (sure the few videos of it live that I've seen basically cut the intro). Oh and the production job that makes the Tom's sound like cardboard boxes doesn't help either.
They're decent live and some of their albums are good ("StEA" would be my favourite) but I've never understood their status - much better bands from this isle, IMO.
Some of ye need to get over to the controversial opinions thread!
I used to be, and still am fanatical about Spirit The Earth Aflame. It is the true embodiment of all things pagan and atavistic and is surely one of the greatest releases from Ireland.
The last time I saw them live however they paled in comparison to the sheer power displayed by supports Desaster and Solstice.
I have no interest in them past The Gathering Wildness.
Just went up today
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xu9bYyimlN4
Got the demo back when i was a young fella,couldn't believe they were Irish,just seemed more professional (bigger) than other Irish bands at the time.When Imrana got released the album cover was the back page of Terrorizer mag,that was a huge deal in my eyes at the time
Saw them plenty of times throught the 90s abd into the 2000s,
There was a period where they were a real force live,definitely around Spirit and Storm era,a real energy and most of the set were real bangers!
Quote from: Melmoth on May 23, 2020, 03:32:42 PM
Just went up today
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xu9bYyimlN4
I enjoyed that. God to hear a bit of background to the themes and to see the original drawing avec pentagram that was edited and used for the cover.
Quote from: Necro Red on May 23, 2020, 09:12:37 AM
I recently watched that documentary on them which was great, although Alan seems to speak over some of the boys throughout it.
I've been meaning to watch this for years, gonna get through it over the next couple of days; shot of whiskey every time Nemty says "late 80s, early 90s". On me fuckin' ear!
If you stand up every time he describes Dublin as being rough and third world in the 90s you'll get a good workout too :laugh:
Primordial are an institution for me - feel like I grew up with the band, it was great in the mid to late 00's seeing them go from local heroes to international success. Their golden age was from Spirit to Nameless Dead, all 4 of those records are classics for me. After that it was good rather than great albums, but they've never released a dud either. Mind you I could never get into Redemption.
TTND and The Gathering Wilderness are the best two, followed by A Journey's End. I haven't listened to them in a while though.
I don't get the dislike for Where Greater Men...., the main issue with that record is that it feels more like a compilation than an album. There are four excellent songs there - title track, Ghosts Of The Charnel House (which has an open riffing style I would like them to have done more of), Born To Night (total Lizzy worship) and the closer which is a hark back to their older albums. The other tracks are either OK or not that great.
Redemption is probably my least favourite, it sounds forced and isn't as tuneful as the albums either side of it. I liked some songs but not able to get into it really.
The last one was a return to form, it flowed well.
Quote from: Eoin McLove on May 23, 2020, 07:12:44 PM
If you stand up every time he describes Dublin as being rough and third world in the 90s you'll get a good workout too :laugh:
I've been getting up to stir the coddle at those points :laugh:
What’s the documentary mentioned earlier in the thread?
I love Redemption but the last 2; particularly the latest haven’t got many spins from me. I was late enough listening to them so the first I bought as it was released was TGW. That’s a superb album. I’ve seen them over the years and when they are in fire they really are something special.
I remember they played here in Cork one roasting Saturday evening in the Phoenix I think it was . It was a real scorcher if a day and the bar ran out of ice..
Also at the end of the set AA took a dive off the stage but it didn’t work out so well.
:laugh: :laugh:
Quote from: Eoin McLove on May 23, 2020, 07:12:44 PM
If you stand up every time he describes Dublin as being rough and third world in the 90s you'll get a good workout too :laugh:
Quote from: Circlepit on May 23, 2020, 09:49:22 PM
I remember they played here in Cork one roasting Saturday evening in the Phoenix I think it was . It was a real scorcher if a day and the bar ran out of ice..
Also at the end of the set AA took a dive off the stage but it didn't work out so well.
Spot on,late 90s ,fuckin baking hot summer day,i still remember sitting outside boozing in the sun!.
Quote from: Circlepit on May 23, 2020, 09:49:22 PM
What's the documentary mentioned earlier in the thread?
I love Redemption but the last 2; particularly the latest haven't got many spins from me. I was late enough listening to them so the first I bought as it was released was TGW. That's a superb album. I've seen them over the years and when they are in fire they really are something special.
I remember they played here in Cork one roasting Saturday evening in the Phoenix I think it was . It was a real scorcher if a day and the bar ran out of ice..
Also at the end of the set AA took a dive off the stage but it didn't work out so well.
https://youtu.be/dNJEIcXhkzk
Quote from: Paul keohane on May 23, 2020, 09:53:58 PM
Quote from: Circlepit on May 23, 2020, 09:49:22 PM
I remember they played here in Cork one roasting Saturday evening in the Phoenix I think it was . It was a real scorcher if a day and the bar ran out of ice..
Also at the end of the set AA took a dive off the stage but it didn't work out so well.
Spot on,late 90s ,fuckin baking hot summer day,i still remember sitting outside boozing in the sun!.
I remember there was so many of us outside the police came to move us on. Great day! I can't remember who else played. Maybe Mael Mordha
Quote from: Circlepit on May 23, 2020, 10:48:00 PM
Quote from: Paul keohane on May 23, 2020, 09:53:58 PM
Quote from: Circlepit on May 23, 2020, 09:49:22 PM
I remember they played here in Cork one roasting Saturday evening in the Phoenix I think it was . It was a real scorcher if a day and the bar ran out of ice..
Also at the end of the set AA took a dive off the stage but it didn't work out so well.
Spot on,late 90s ,fuckin baking hot summer day,i still remember sitting outside boozing in the sun!.
I remember there was so many of us outside the police came to move us on. Great day! I can't remember who else played. Maybe Mael Mordha
What, Sting and the boys?
That's right.! I'm fairly sure they didn't care for the tunes.
AA for me is as good a front man as you are going to get but as someone mentioned here on that documentary he really does cut across the other lads on numerous occasions. He comes across as someone who is obviously highly intelligent but is trying too hard to prove that. I actually said as much on a post on the old forum that vanished a day or two later. In fairness some lads were cutting him in two if I recall correctly.....
I remember the gig in the Phoenix as well. Can't remember exactly, will need Shane on here to recall, but it might have been Thus Defiled, not 100% sure, but I remember they had keyboards and were doing some fire breathing as well. Or else the memory is playing tricks. I first met the lads in Cork, might have been the gig in Leap if anyone remembers that or else in Nancy Spain's on the Sundays afternoons were superb, can't remember who it was with but it was during the Imrama demo days as far as I remember. Been a big fan since their demos but lost touch for 10 to 15 years or so. Used to buy Celtic Frost bootleg tapes off Alan back in the 90's. Always found him and the rest of the lads to be super pleasant to deal with throughout the years. In the tape trading days he used to sign off all letters with "Die Hard", Venom quote I think. AA was always the biggest metal head. Everyone is entitled to their opinion but I for one am very proud of these guys and for how they portray us overseas. They are loved far more outside of Ireland that within, which is a shame. Can't say any more at how proud we all are of Michael as well to be with them so long.
They were two separate gigs in the Phoenix that time (thus Defiled and the other Primordial), Abaddon Incarnate and Dreamsfear definitely played also,which gigs is another guess!
Was at the Anathem and Primordial gig in Leap too.
Shot of cognac whenever he name drops 'Gehenna'
They are not that good by the way, very puzzling why he keeps using them as a reference. It's like dropping 'blackshephard' whilst trying to contradict big Caomhaoin.
Ultimately, you'll come up short. I probably speak better French than him, and I definitely speak better metal.
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on May 23, 2020, 06:47:33 PM
Quote from: Necro Red on May 23, 2020, 09:12:37 AM
I recently watched that documentary on them which was great, although Alan seems to speak over some of the boys throughout it.
I've been meaning to watch this for years, gonna get through it over the next couple of days; shot of whiskey every time Nemty says "late 80s, early 90s". On me fuckin' ear!
It's interesting how about the time they appear to have fallen out of favour with Irish listeners (10/15 years ago) is about the time they went huge in Europe.
Maybe we don't have that kind of generic, semi mainstream metalhead scene here. The few listeners we do have being more into their niche and underground stuff?
The kind of Primordial fans I've randomly (randomly meaning outside of a metal context) encountered in France, both French and from other countries, have been just that kind of, as you put it, "semi mainstream metalhead". People who listen, let's say, towards the underground but aren't at all part of the underground scene, nor interested in "living the life", or whatever. Ironically, this is the kind of thing AA endlessly used to say metal was all about, but their success is measured also by their success among people for whom metal is absolutely not a lifestyle.
Just finished the doc there. Could have done with more about the song-writing procedure, which was just shoe-horned in at the end, but was the only part where the other band members really got a chance to express themselves. Simon's presentation of his style was deadly.
Definitely lost the plot about the Ireland in the 80s stuff by trying to draw a parallel to places as disparate as Serbia and, um, Birmingham. In doing so AA drifted away from what was unique about Ireland throughout the 80s; the conflicted remnants of a struggle against empire pervading the aesthetic (Bobby Sands and IRA graffiti all over town, but no mainstream united Ireland discourse, only mainstream condemnation of terrorism), of the dream of being a republic turning into a rather sad and grey reality for the hundreds of thousands of unemployed and emigrating, and so on. All this stuff is there in the feel of their albums, it's a huge part of what makes those of us who grew up through that connect to, for example, The Coffin Ships; lost to Ireland, lost in vain. Knowing life was shit, but not nearly as shit as what our forebears had been through; wanting to be bitter but not knowing if it was really justified for our generation, grey and hopeless as it seemed. That was the 80s in Ireland, and it's much more interesting than "yeah, Dublin's a bit like Birmingham." So yeah, a funny disconnect between what AA taps into as, let's say, a poet, and what he's reduced to when he plays the role of "pillar of metal heritage".
Being honest, I'd say the Blood Revolt album is my favourite thing Alan has ever been involved in, Top20 album of all time for me, probably. Perfect execution and delivery in every way.
Imrama and A Journey's End never really clicked with me, maybe didn't spend the time with them, but I'd say its 10 years since I've dug either of them out. To me the Storm Before Calm, Gathering Wilderness, To The Nameless Dead run was the peak - perfect blends of the earlier stuff, with TTND showing where they'd go. The albums since have really just been a subpar rehash in many respects of the ideas of TTND, bar a few moments on WGMHF popping above the parapet. Have tried with the latest a few times, couldn't really be arsed. A Journeys End is another where I couldn't tell you the last time I stuck it on, but its definitely an album I enjoy.
The TBMC release gig in Jan08 felt HUGE at the time. A band moving from one level to another, the hype was through the roof for it and off the back of a savage album. A great afternoon boozing with heads from Metal Ireland too.
Probably go back to The Gathering Wilderness most, a real grey October/November day album, absolutely perfect.
Quote from: Squigs on May 25, 2020, 01:32:17 PM
The TBMC release gig in Jan08 felt HUGE at the time. A band moving from one level to another, the hype was through the roof for it and off the back of a savage album. A great afternoon boozing with heads from Metal Ireland too.
I wasnt at it,but i can remember there was a big buzz about it,as you said it had a feel at the time that an irish band had moved up levels.First time you could say an irish crowd latched on to a irish metal band and turned out in numbers to support them.
I think it sold out? Was definitely rammed, big European attendance too - that was the show that was recorded for DVD, but wasn't released bar the footage of Empire Falls. The DVD was from the following gig in January, if I'm remembering right.
Wonder if they will hit the big leagues in the coming few years. Maiden and Priest are in the twilight of their careers. Slayer are cooked, Megadeth are not going to be around forever. Consider the likes of Primordial, Amon Amarth and Behemoth taking the leap up.
I thought they were going to take another step up around the time Where Greater Men... came out, they were getting hyped a lot in fairly mainstream media, the album even got reviewed by Rolling Stone, and then when Exile came out it barely got any attention at all.
Quote from: hellfire on May 25, 2020, 04:30:41 PM
Wonder if they will hit the big leagues in the coming few years. Maiden and Priest are in the twilight of their careers. Slayer are cooked, Megadeth are not going to be around forever. Consider the likes of Primordial, Amon Amarth and Behemoth taking the leap up.
No offence but them comparisons are enough to turn my stomach. 3 absolutely mediocre bands taking the place of gods of metal.
Who if anyone will headline festivals and large venues in ten years?
Quote from: Pedrito on May 25, 2020, 05:16:08 PM
Quote from: hellfire on May 25, 2020, 04:30:41 PM
Wonder if they will hit the big leagues in the coming few years. Maiden and Priest are in the twilight of their careers. Slayer are cooked, Megadeth are not going to be around forever. Consider the likes of Primordial, Amon Amarth and Behemoth taking the leap up.
No offence but them comparisons are enough to turn my stomach. 3 absolutely mediocre bands taking the place of gods of metal.
I'll make it worse for you so; in terms of mainstream pull, it's more likely to be the likes of Avenged Sevenfold. Primordial, AA and Behemoth don't even come close to the levels of popularity Maiden, Priest, Megadeth, etc., hit in their prime. On the other hand, I wouldn't call Primordial mediocre at all; there's no one like them for them to be mediocre alongside, making them truly and strictly speaking exceptional.
I was at Wacken in 2014. Amon Amarth definitely had the drawing power to fill the main stage twice over.
Wacken isn't exactly representative though, is it? Maiden, Priest and Megadeth were filling huge venues all around the world on headlining tours in the prime. Just look at where those three bands were playing in Ireland and the UK at the top of their game. AA don't come close.
Foo Fighters are probably the closest thing to a metal band to fill that gap.
Have Primordial ever played Download? Surely that’s more mainstream than the mainland Europe ones. I’m not implying that Wacken or Hellfest are underground or extreme by the way.
I would have thought that Download would be more Metal Hammer than Zero than Terrorizer. So info Primordial were playing that festival it would indicate them having more of a mainstream appeal.
Regardless I’d like to see them at one of the outdoor main stage larger festivals to see how it translates.
Are Behemoth and Amon Amarth a bit on the extreme end of the scale compared to Maiden,Priest,Megadeth etc?.Is it a fair comparison?.
My 8 yr old is obsessed with Amon Amarth. So I dunno if they are that extreme!!
Who would be the biggest draw at a fest these days that would satisfy all types of metal heads?.Im not talking about one of the old guard (Maiden,Priest,Megadeth etc),but a more recent act?.
Amon Amarth have got massive alright,only really noticed when they did a promo video of their stage rig on a recent tour.
Yeah, but you're comparing to bands who charted - like normal charts charted - at the peak of their careers. There's maybe Tool, Slipknot from a generation one past the old school. After that, like it or not, it's your Avenged Sevenfolds and Triviums who are becoming big pulls as far as I can see... all bands who chart, all bands who fall under "metal", and bands who, perhaps surprisingly, do have a wide fan base...just not in the deep underground.
Slipknot are a massive draw. No doubt at all. Trivium not as much. There was a time when it seemed they were going to break into higher echelons but it no longer seems to be the case. They churn out records but they don't seem to get any bigger.
Anyway back to Primordial. In light if this thread I'm going to give the older albums more time.
On his podcast AA speaks about the recording process of Imrama. It's worth a listen.
Yes, back to Primordial. I listened to Imrama and Journey's End yesterday and enjoyed the hell out of them. Imrama I knew I would, but I couldn't tell you last time I listened to Journey's End, more than a decade probably. Every album, up to and including TTND is really unique, with only a kind of family resemblance between them. Post TTND (I think someone said already), it just seems different configurations of that blueprint, and where they do differ I find myself reminded of Dread Sovereign style simplicity (but that might just be my brain making a lazy association).
...
Quote from: Circlepit on May 25, 2020, 09:21:35 PM
Slipknot are a massive draw. No doubt at all. Trivium not as much. There was a time when it seemed they were going to break into higher echelons but it no longer seems to be the case. They churn out records but they don't seem to get any bigger.
Anyway back to Primordial. In light if this thread I'm going to give the older albums more time.
On his podcast AA speaks about the recording process of Imrama. It's worth a listen.
Whats the name of the podcast?
Also I'd agree with those saying it'll be fucking avenge sevenfold and maybe slipknot who'll take over the large gigs. No issue with slip to be fair, they have paid their dues. Sevenfold are just bad.
Quote from: StrangersWithGuns on May 28, 2020, 04:01:59 PM
Quote from: Circlepit on May 25, 2020, 09:21:35 PM
Slipknot are a massive draw. No doubt at all. Trivium not as much. There was a time when it seemed they were going to break into higher echelons but it no longer seems to be the case. They churn out records but they don’t seem to get any bigger.
Anyway back to Primordial. In light if this thread I’m going to give the older albums more time.
On his podcast AA speaks about the recording process of Imrama. It’s worth a listen.
Whats the name of the podcast?
Also I'd agree with those saying it'll be fucking avenge sevenfold and maybe slipknot who'll take over the large gigs. No issue with slip to be fair, they have paid their dues. Sevenfold are just bad.
It’s called Agitators Anonymous. He has about 6 up now. Some are better than others as he waffles a bit. They are still entertaining though. He has one about STEA that’s just gone up..
Sevenfold can work a big crowd and keep them engaged. Love them or hate them is besides the point. I love how insanely jealous Robb Flynn is of their headline status.
After the documentary, the gig!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MNE8BHkt-Bc
Excellent performance. There's been so much intervening madness, I can't recall off-hand whether I was there for both the 2008 and 2009 TBMC gigs or just the former.
https://youtu.be/yZsMBVU9TwM
Rome have turned woeful and the bould Nemty joins in with his new toe curling style on this collaboration track.
Bring back the raw honesty of Autumn's Ablaze.
Dunno what you mean, really. Sounds to me like Alan doing his thing. Not the most exciting song in the world perhaps, Rome are a bit samey to say the least but that is a grand little song.
Is it not fairly obvious what I mean? I find the overly effected crooning style of latter day AA pretty cringey to listen to. Much preferring the less polished, less skilled, less thought out but very distinct and heartfelt style of JE/STEA.
And Rome are gone to shit too.
I thought he reined it in there, actually. Especially compared with some of the high pitched wailing he does these days which sometimes works and sometimes doesn't. Sure look it.
Not a band I've ever listened to before, so I wouldn't know if it's a band gone stale. Sounded alright to me. They worth checking out?
I don't own any of their albums so maybe I'm not qualified to make this kind of a claim, but when has that stopped me before. From my YouTube travels I find their style to be quite samey, right down to almost identical melodies being repeated in better or worse iterations across their ouevre. This is the absolute pinnacle of anything of theirs I have heard and I think it's a really quite beautiful and emotional piece. Great video, too. *
https://youtu.be/FpPEwyvwvYc
*perfect opportunity to link a vid of a man getting fisted or shat on. Next time, I promise.
Quite a similar buzz to The National there.
Quote from: Eoin McLove on May 30, 2020, 11:37:36 AM
I don't own any of their albums so maybe I'm not qualified to make this kind of a claim, but when has that stopped me before. From my YouTube travels I find their style to be quite samey, right down to almost identical melodies being repeated in better or worse iterations across their ouevre. This is the absolute pinnacle of anything of theirs I have heard and I think it's a really quite beautiful and emotional piece. Great video, too. *
https://youtu.be/FpPEwyvwvYc
*perfect opportunity to link a vid of a man getting fisted or shat on. Next time, I promise.
The parish priest look seems to be making a comeback this year.
...
I've never been a big fan of their music but I saw them live supporting Opeth in 2003 and they were fantastic to watch. I've had a few conversations with Alan in Bruxelles over the years too. He's a nice guy.
...
Quote from: mugz on June 04, 2020, 10:57:54 PM
Quote from: RangerX on June 04, 2020, 10:55:02 PM
was that at whelans? I thought madder mortem supported?
No it was at Vicar Street. I remember it well because I saw Metallica for the first time the next night. That was a great weekend.
Primordial/Opeth was 06 on a Monday. Down played that week as did Sick of it All along with the Download weekend with GnR, Alice In Chains and Metallica.
Quote from: open face surgery on June 07, 2020, 06:46:25 PM
Primordial/Opeth was 06 on a Monday. Down played that week as did Sick of it All along with the Download weekend with GnR, Alice In Chains and Metallica.
Tool played the Saturday before Opeth iirc
You don't.
I am a Primordial virgin. Never a word about them down the years round these parts. I love Mourning Beloveth so need to get up to date on Primordial now for next February, I'm liking what I'm hearing so far.
As you can see from the name, I'm a big fan of Storm Before Calm. Its a cracker of an album. Kinda lost touch with them over the lest few years though.I must get some of the newer stuff and see what all the fuss over AAs vocals is about. heard Coffin Ships there recently all right, nothing wrong with his vocals there! fucking great tune.
That was interesting to hear the story behind each song. I think I'll look for the documentary too.
According to the AA podcast they are planning on recording either towards the end of this year or very early next year. Will this be the one to pull it back?
Pull it back? In terms of quality do you mean? I thought the last full length was better than 'Where Greater Men Have Fallen'.
The last album was a great return to form after two lacklustre records.
Had To The Nameless Dead on today for the first time in a while, seriously powerful album throughout. Traitors Gate is a great balance of their epic and more aggressive sides.
Would like to see them explore ideas along the lines of The Alchemist's Head from Where Greater Have Fallen on some future material, I think that track hints at a vein of creativity they could tap into more.
Yep, that's a great song. I'd be very happy to see them do a fully dark BM album.
The last album didn't pull me in at all! I love Redemption... I must give the last one more time as it many of ye called it a return to form.
Also the last track off Where Greater... is that be of my favourite Primordial tracks.
I don't know what I want from them now. Epic rabbi rousing blasting?!!
I'd say Nemty's podcasts would rouse a rabbi or two.
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on August 05, 2020, 11:01:12 PM
I'd say Nemty's podcasts would rouse a rabbi or two.
I just saw what I posted. My phone and it's gimp case and my gimp thumbs. Rabble rousing. If a rabbi or 2 gets roused and aroused then so be it.
The Gathering Wilderness on here now. What a brilliant album. While I really like two out of the four that followed it I think it is maybe their last true artistic statement. It was a dark, bold step into new territory at the time. They kind of became more about individual songs after this as opposed to being strongly album focused, or that's how I'd read it anyway (and saying that, the most recent album was a beaut despite the fact) and as I mentioned above I'd love to hear them do a full album of dark and complex songs in the vein of The Alchemist's Head but it seems they are on their own road, so it's unlikely.
Will always be my favourite Primordial. Absolutely incredible and I agree about it maybe being their last artistic statement. Just can't muster up the love for anything that came after it despite enjoying bits and pieces of them.
AA goes through each album every so often in his podcast and in the one I listened to today he said Redemption is probably his favourite! I really like that album but it's not my favourite.
I have a lot of love for Redemption, I think it's a great midway between various periods and strands of musical and lyrical ideas. But I think I'm probably in a minority with my Primordial preferences. New album does nothing for me at all and The Gathering
Wilderness I find to be a bit of an odd duck. It has an odd sounding muffled mix that kills some of the music. I prefer to listen to live versions of TGW songs, cause some of the songwriting is cracking.
I'm enjoying his podcasts, they are enjoyable and informative.
Im definitely more of a fan of their newer stuff. From TTND onwards has been great, but the newest one is easily their best output for me. I think with Empire Falls they found a groove that for me at least, really works. I like some of the earlier releases but they've really hit a purple patch these last few. That latest album is one i keep going back to, over and over.
The podcast is great! Great stuff.
Primordial were one of these bands I glossed over back in the early 2000's thinking that no good extreme metal could possibly come from Ireland when I was a teen.
Been revisiting a lot of metal I missed out on in the last couple months to a year and I am honestly completely blown away by Primordial. The fact they're Irish makes me an even harsher critic. I love their early stuff and the new albums, great themes and concepts throughout. To be honest, currently my favorite album is between A Journey's End or Spirit The Earth Aflame. Just love those albums.
Vocals are incredible. I read lots of people complaining about them online because they'd rather straight up shrieks - WTF, and let the music lose its power? The vocals make the band completely unique.
I don't get the disparagement for Where Greater Men Have Fallen. I seem to recall that on the old board the album was relatively well received when it came out as being something of a return to form following Redemption.
It's certainly a more memorable album than Redemption I think. Its main issue is that it sounds more like a compilation than a coherent statement - something the most recent album addressed well.
The highlights are: the title track (great opener, sets up the record nicely), Ghosts Of The Charnel House (interesting wide riffing hard rock style and very heavy), Born To Night (total Lizzy worship) and Wield Lightning To Split The Sun (rather old school in terms of structure and lyrics).
The other four tracks are either good (Babel's Tower) or by the numbers (Come The Flood). The only one that doesn't work is The Alchemist's Head (appreciate that it's about William Blake, but musically it does nothing for me).
Not their best album, but definitely still has its moments.
To me Exile Amongst the Ruins is a return to form after some weaker albums. Stolen Years, Last Call, and the title track are very good songs.
It's a cracker. It'll be interesting to see where they go next. I find they seem to operate in cycles of three so maybe the next two albums will be in a similar vein to Exile, but I'd like to see them go really dark. A focus on their harsher BM style would be great, but probably unlikely.
Two words - Blood Revolt :abbath:
Savage album indeed.
Could Primordial incorporate that urban grime and futility , would it still be Primordial? I don't know but that's where I'm at, the word 'Harsh' you used, that's a watchword I'd like to see Primordial work by.
No, I think they are two distinct entities. That urban feel wouldn't be Primordial. I think that the guitar style of Primordial is so rooted in a folk way of playing with those vast, open chords and the bodhrán- like rhythms that it will generally have a dark pastoral feel to it.
I suppose they have incorporated more classic rock techniques on the last couple of albums that contradict what I've said, but they still sound far removed from the brutal, urban atmosphere of Blood Revolt.
Yep, completely different entities , incompatible, loved the latest Primordial in fairness but I'd be more looking out for Alan's side projects these days.
I get the impression some members of the band have no desire to incorporate a harsher black metal sound these days. I'd love to see them mix it up a bit too, but it's highly unlikely.
Dark pastoral? There are some properly feral moments on earlier stuff, and some fairly anthemic moments on newer stuff that is urban, albeit in a kind of Renaissance era kinda urban way. Will we ever hear cement and industry from Primordial? It would certainly take some deep creative genius to pull it off, but I wouldn't say impossible; if they wanted, for example, to conjure a return to nature type vibe, it should pass via a representation of what's being rejected.
Is it giving them too much credit to think they'd be up to a task of that scope? I don't think so, but that's not to say it would occur to them.
Yeah they certainly have their fierce moments but those elements have always been in context with the folky (not exactly the right word), pastoral (not exactly the right word) primordial(!) and timeless quality of their overall sound and aesthetic.
They have never sounded urban in the sense that their music has an earthiness to it. They sound more elemental than cosmopolitan.
Edit. It might also be that I view them in those terms as opposed to them strictly adhering to those specific traits, but urban gritiness wouldn't come to my mind when listening to a Primordial album.
I just listened to End of All Times (Martyrs Fire) on YouTube and it prompted me to grab The Gathering Wilderness off the shelf. I suspect it will be on rotation in the car for the foreseeable.
Quote from: Eoin McLove on September 22, 2020, 10:34:15 PM
I just listened to End of All Times (Martyrs Fire) on YouTube and it prompted me to grab The Gathering Wilderness off the shelf. I suspect it will be on rotation in the car for the foreseeable.
I have The Gathering Wilderness on now
Cracking album
Everyone is on fire on it
The overall mix/sound suits them very well
First Primordial album I bought and first time ever hearing the band. Bought it at Graspop festival of all places when I was about 17 and fired it on the Walkman I had brought with me for tunes, while hanging around the campsite the next morning. It'll always hold a special spot for me in their discography.
I've heard complaints about the murky production on here and MI, but I think the whole package is spot on from production to artwork to the songs.
Some bollix has my CD version, after I'd lent it and forgotten to whom. Going to throw it on Spotify soon. This post has also brought me to question how the fuck I managed to bring CDs with me to that festival, and why I hadn't gotten an iPod by then in 2004. :-\
Have TGW on now.
'Cities Carved In Stone' might be the most restrained/downtempo song they've ever written. Not really anything like it on any album until the last one where they had a more mellow sounding track or two (Stolen Years).
Listening to TGW on repeat the last couple of days myself. Works well this time of year for me.
Sale on Primordial merch on the Kings Road webstore until tomorrow evening:
https://eu.kingsroadmerch.com/metal-blade/search/index.php?search=primordial
https://youtu.be/bcSWHu9X00M
I wasn't at this gig unfortunately. I'm sure a few on here were. Probably the best I've ever heard the band perform to be honest, particularly the vocal performance. The Coffin Ships and a couple more songs from this gig are also up on YT and it's the same consistency throughout. Absolutely deadly!
I have A Journey's End on at the moment and it's not one I reach for very often when in a Primordial mood. I don't know why I don't give it more time as it is a fantastic album. They arguably peaked with their early embryonic style on the next album, Spirit the Earth Aflame, but this album is so gloomy and experimental that it really captures my imagination whenever I do choose to listen to it. The old musty photographs of the trees and the workmen walking through the fields captures the atmosphere of the music quite well, too. I love the mix of styles used across the album, and yet despite the difference between the epicness and savagery of the likes of Bitter Harvest, the acoustic Dark Song, the drone of Solitary Mourner (an unusual choice for the time, perhaps?), the seemingly omnipresent acoustic guitar strumming behind the electric, the album is a coherent whole. There is so much to get lost in.
It is the sound of a band out on their own, haunting the outer periphery of black metal, pagan folk metal and doom. A masterpiece? Maybe baby.
Nice version of Journeys end at this gig.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qf-vARq8Vc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qf-vARq8Vc)
It's excellent. It's the sound of a band knowing they are on to something but yet to fully have the musical vocabulary to really express it. The gathering wilderness.... Here they fully know who they are and what they want to say and how to say it.
After listening to all AA's podcasts I wonder to the rest of the band ever wish he would whisht???!!!
Imrama on now. Flanger abuse till death!
Had A Journey's End on lately as well. A great album that I too need to go to more often.
Such a gloomy bastard of an album. I'm like a broken record but I'd love to hear them write an album with a darker edge to it again, despite really enjoying the generally more carefree style of the last one. The anthems are cool in their own right, no doubt, but I find myself more drawn to their more difficult or obscure sounding albums.
I played Journeys End to bits back in the day, would still consider it my favourite but it'd be Spirit or TGW I'd reach for nowadays.
It was great to finally see them play the Dark Song of Éireann live back in 2010(? not sure when it was exactly)
Quote from: Eoin McLove on December 01, 2020, 10:24:34 PM
Such a gloomy bastard of an album. I'm like a broken record but I'd love to hear them write an album with a darker edge to it again, despite really enjoying the generally more carefree style of the last one. The anthems are cool in their own right, no doubt, but I find myself more drawn to their more difficult or obscure sounding albums.
Difficult and obscure doesn't pay unfortunately, not that Primordial are rolling in it by any means. I'd rather a return to the early stuff as well, that said I love the later stuff, except stolen years which is an abomination.
Funny. I've become quite fond of that track
I'm a fan of Stolen Years. Might throw that album on tomorrow. I haven't had a listen to it in a while after heavy hinging upon its release.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uiA9svQRoxs
Saw that earlier. Weird that it's referred to as being unreleased as there was a 7" version of it released ten years ago or more.
https://www.metal-archives.com/albums/Plagued/Blood_League_-_Fire_Still_Burns/178558
Quote from: Eoin McLove on December 04, 2020, 02:56:53 PM
Saw that earlier. Weird that it's referred to as being unreleased as there was a 7" version of it released ten years ago or more.
https://www.metal-archives.com/albums/Plagued/Blood_League_-_Fire_Still_Burns/178558
Wierd indeed... seeing as I'm looking at the 7" in my hands right now ;D
Could it perhaps be a signal of further Plagued activity? The thick plottens!
Any sign of a new Primordial album in the pipeline?
I see Mr Avril and Bones (amongst others) from Dread Sovereign collaborated with Wolvennest (who are class) for that Roadburn special Nest...
https://metalstorm.net/pub/review.php?review_id=17568&page=&message_id=
I was listening to an update on Alan's patreon recently re new Primordial material - they are working on songs but doesn't sound like it's anywhere near being ready.
Maybe an album by the end of the year but next year more likely.
Aha, very good. I saw him at both The Ruins Of Beverast and the Wardruna gigs a couple of weeks ago. He seemed in top tune both nights...
If any of you are slugging a few tonight. You could do worse than throw on that Nest live video in the link on my previous post. What a performance that was...
Ive met him about 10 times over the years and it's developed into a Mr Burns/Homer Simpson situation so I give up.
Listening to TGW (and on proper speakers once the Mrs heads off to work), the closer is such a fucking choon. It's such a dense album that it's easy get worn out, but some way to end what is, for me, their undisputed chef d'œuvre.
Also, that pseudo-trad song off Imrama is a bit of a gem too. The bodhrán sound is dreadful (or else it's a total amateur playing) but it's goosebump inducing stuff if you're in the right mood.
Just seen on FB they seem to be hinting at some sort 'Best of' album...and a 'volume 1' at that, would be a bit of a strange move.
Perhaps they have a deal with Metal Blade to release a certain amount? Contract obligations and that?
"Do the Best Of first, then we'll see about getting you a Live At Budokan, promise."
I think it's just a Spotify playlist as an introduction for new listeners.
aka -
Vol 1: Spirit the Earth Aflame
😀
I really enjoy what he is doing on his podcast at the moment the tour diary stuff. Good to know relentless shit is just part of the gig and there is always something. It does seem ridiculous given all they have achieved the mainstream ignores them so blatantly.
I'm not sure why the mainstream would pay attention to Primordial when they have ignored metal entirely for around three decades at this stage.
Happen to be listening to Dark Romanticism here.
Has Alan been complaining about the mainstream ignoring metal again? Has long seemed to me he, and a few others, don't know what they want; tr00ness or mainstream recognition.
You have inspired me to stick on Dark Romanticism for the first time in ages. Bloody great demo. It's arguably more focused and cohesive than Imrama and Journey's End in a way. Those albums, while highly enjoyable, seem to reach a little out beyond the band's ability. That youthful energy and clumsiness makes them charming and of their time (in a positive way) but the more direct approach of the demo seems to sit together a little more comfortably. Or maybe I'm spouting shite...
Strong urge to listen to 'The Gathering Wilderness' so I've grabbed the CD off the shelf for the drive to work tomorrow. Ripper!
The lads must have new stuff in the works at this stage. It will be interesting to see what comes out. I really liked the last album. It sounded more like a random collection of ideas that all happened to be good rather than a singular, focused entity, so I wonder what kind of approach they'll use next time around. A bit of boldness, adventurousness and experimentation suits them. Then again, I would also love to hear them go for something really dark again but I think Alan is more interested in writing choruses for the live arena than going all out grim (with Primordial, that is) so it's probably unlikely we'll see a return to the more sprawling, slightly less focused but more obscurely interesting style of yore. Let's find out!
If they've something new in the works, they may air something at the gig with MB in town.
He said on his podcast that rather than go for an upbeat " we are through Covid so let's celebrate hooray " type album they are going for the filth and incorporating some of the old style traditional elements.
There is every chance I imagined this though.
Well that sounds promising if it's not just a dream you had. Any idea which episode it was?
I can't remember which one.
He made the point a few times in various episodes that while some musicians said the lockdowns allowed them time to be creative and write new stuff he found it to the exact opposite.
He listened to dark, heavy abrasive music. He 100% said about going back k to the older Primordial style at one point.
That could all change in the rehearsal room of course.
If they made mixture of The Gathering Wilderness and Redemption I would be more than happy.
The last one never fully clicked with me.
Quote from: Circlepit on September 10, 2022, 03:31:21 PMI can't remember which one.
He made the point a few times in various episodes that while some musicians said the lockdowns allowed them time to be creative and write new stuff he found it to the exact opposite.
He listened to dark, heavy abrasive music. He 100% said about going back k to the older Primordial style at one point.
That could all change in the rehearsal room of course.
If they made mixture of The Gathering Wilderness and Redemption I would be more than happy.
The last one never fully clicked with me.
He does not seem like the loner type, so that would make sense about the lockdown stifling him. I hope they do go back to their older style - he needs to forget about Primordial being a stadium rock band :) That said I ended up quite liking Exile Amongst the Ruins. Stolen Years is a fantastic song.
Would love to hear their older sound rear its ugly head again also. Been listening to Suns First Rays loads lately, those chords in the main verse riff are magic.
They have some rehearsal tracks up on Spotify now called the Camelot sessions... Some interesting curios
I'm not on Spotify but I'll see if they are up on YouTube later. Cheers.
Find them a bit samey but I can see their why they are so popular and they have some great tunes .
A journey's end being my personal favourite .
A return to older vibes sounds brilliant but I wouldn't hold out much hope. They lost the plot about 15 years ago with AA ditching most of the harsh vocals and limited but charming clean vox in favour of an unnatural, strained epic style that is sung too high.
If he dialled it back a bit (a lot) they might become listenable again. Something along the lines of Storm Before Calm would be great. Plenty of dark, aggressive tracks and then Sons of the Morrigan. For the last 15 years Primordial appear to be geared specifically for the summer festival circuit but have they written as good a live song as Sons in that time that wasn't just all about a big chorus?
The Coffin Ships?
Storm Before Calm is savage. I would welcome a return to that style and I agree with the comment about the vocals. I think his 'new' aggressive singing style can work but he uses it too much. He has a fair oul snarl on him still so it would be good to hear him utilise it more.
Storm Before Calm is my favourite Primordial but it's a very high standard we're talking about here , every single Primordial album is a quality submission to the Metal Pantheon, ..we'll miss 'em when they go.. There has obviously been a play to the festival crowds as the band has progressed, good luck to them, it doesn't necessarily suit me laying back on my couch listening to them but for sheer consistency there aren't too many bands around who can live with our lads. ...And they haven't donned ice skates yet
Storm my favourite by them too,peak Primordial for me!
Grim Reality summed it up perfectly there, defo went the way of summer festival orientated and adopted a repetitive formula.
Spirit just shades Storm for me, but yeah that's where it's at, some peak that is probably impossible to match or capture again.
I would vote for Spirit as well. What an album. It is mighty and epic but still has a dark, underground (and unrefrigerated going by my predictive text) feel to it. I don't hold it against them for mixing up their formula and aiming for greater success- all power to them- but I think the earlier albums prove to be more timeless.
The purveyors and kings of unrefrigerated metal! :laugh: :abbath:
That early stuff is proving to have long life qualities!
I wonder what the chances are of them ever doing reprints of the old tshirt designs. I check their website every so often in hopes of finding a design I like but really what I want is Dark Romanticism, Imrama, A Journey's End, Spirit the Earth Aflame and Storm Before Calm tshirts.
Cool.
Quote from: Eoin McLove on September 15, 2022, 09:03:06 AMI wonder what the chances are of them ever doing reprints of the old tshirt designs. I check their website every so often in hopes of finding a design I like but really what I want is Dark Romanticism, Imrama, A Journey's End, Spirit the Earth Aflame and Storm Before Calm tshirts.
Would Hammerheart be any good for them? That's where I got my Storm LS years back at least.
I hadn't thought of that. Must have a gander 8)
I ended up reading back through this entire thread. It's actually an interesting enough oul ramble through all manner of ideas.
Hope you had suitable tunes on while you were at it. Rose Tattoo or the like.
Had a listen back today of some albums to try and track where it went wrong (for me). With the tracks 'the burning season' and 'sons of the morrigan ' are great examples of clean or non-BM vocals that are top class and don't take over the music, rather soar above it. On The Gathering Wilderness are the first hints of big heavy metal vocalist AA, buy on something like 'song of the tomb ', a brilliant song, you can hear its still quite natural and "right". The opener 'the golden spiral ' sets the template for later rabble rousing opening tracks but none meet the standard of this one. The lyrics are fucking class. That vocal bit - "a raven, he watched my every move " gets me every time. Magic!
The next album is full blown festival Primordial. The BM rasp with clean sections is shelved in favour of that aggressive/epic heavy metal singer style 100% of the time. But the songs by and large are great and the vocals not yet overbearing so it's another highwater mark in their career. Though I have never liked As Rome Burns with its obvious crowd participation part.
Sadly the Redemption album which again I excitedly got at the time was a major let down. Only listening to it now as I type for first time since aftermath of release. Very unmemorable and samey. All the boring elements of Primordial coalesce here.
I absolutely respect the band for continuing to put out new music and not just rehash the past.
Listen to the opening section of the Golden Spiral, when the vocals kick in (raised my fist, to the cobalt skyyyyy!). That was sensational. They are a long way from that glory now.
Redemption really was a dull album. I might revisit it today and see if it sounds any better as it is a long time since I listened to it.
I had Spirit on earlier and man, it's so good. I think your assessment is pretty spot on. I miss his old style of singing, even though I like the new aggressive approach too. He should bring the old style back and mix it all up with his savage BM vocals. It seems like he is missing a trick by abandoning his earlier technique completely. But sure, here's me in my armchair ;D
Edit. Lobbed on Redemption.
-No Grave Deep Enough was always a rather strong opener and works well live. I think after this things begin to trail off a bit. Even reading the song titles isn't really stirring much memory of these songs but let's see how we go...
-Lain With the Wolf. Not a bad little melody in the vocals but nothing exceptional either. The song goes nowhere. It builds to nothing, it throws in zero surprises and just kind of happens for seven or so minutes.
- Bloodied Yet Unbowed. This is a bit more like it. The lyrics suck; whiskey soaked 4am bare knuckle pikey shite that Alan seems obsessed with; totally banal. But the music is ripping and might really have benefited from a harsh black metal vocal attack to finish it. The chorus is pretty cool, though.
- God's Old Snake. A weird one. Kind of the inverse of the last song where the music is non-descript but Alan's harsh vocals elevate it. Not bad but a bit middling.
- The Mouth of Judas. I knew there was a song on this one (and I think there's another one on the next album too) where they essentially try to rewrite The Coffin Ships. A futile exercise that renders this song completely worthless while simultaneously cheapening The Coffin Ships in the process... WHY!!!
-The Black Hundred. Nothing about this song rings a bell. Musically it is dark and had potential to become something good but the choice of clean vocals on top doesn't work. The melody is kind of a go-nowhere assemblage of random notes. The exact same thing can be said of the lyrics. Looks like Alan was reading about the Gulags and wanted to write about it but didn't have enough time to develop the idea into an artistic statement. It's a meddly of his stock phrases aiming towards something bigger but not getting there. A missed opportunity here, actually. If they had more time to think about it and develop it it could have become something exciting.
-The Puritan's Hand. Musically OK. Some nice ideas in the mix. Vocally just utterly meh... zero thought or effort applied to the melody; every part is predictable. Early on in the song when Alan hits the higher register, he aims for a lower register iteration of the melody behind the main vocal which sounded cool. That Should have been the main vocal line I reckon, but I'm not sure it would have saved the song from ultimate banality.
-Death of the Gods. Death of my braincells. I'm struggling not to turn it off. The vocal melody has been directly transplanted from something off The Gathering Wilderness, I can't place exactly which song. Musically uninspired.
I mean, fuck, this really is the sound of a band who are low on inspiration but are contractually obliged to vomit out 'content'. A huge drop from a band who were previously on a steady upward trajectory. Where Greater Men Have Fallen followed a very, very similar path with a couple of strong songs padded out with uninspired rubbish. I had all but given up on new Primordial at that stage so Exile Among the Ruins really surprised me. It sounded fresh and invigorating/invigorated. I don't think it will ultimately sit alongside their classics at doomsday, but it boded well for the creative life of the band.
I'm sure I said it before in this thread that I think Redemption is a ripper.
I love the way the opening track feels almost like it's just teetering on the edge of being out of control and they are trying to reign in it.
I get the whole thing about the big festival type heavy metal style but I like it.
I'd say it would take an almighty effort for them to write an album in the old vein, to avoid rehashing old ideas or to avoid aping themselves. Who knows what we'll get next.
I'd love something heavy in every way. Music, lyrics, concept, delivery and belief.
Late '90s, they had an album release downstairs in Fibber's, can anyone remember what it was for? Support was Alan, Darragh O'Leary & Steve Hughes playing covers.
Just curious, that was the last time I had anything to do with them.
The plan over the next few days is to go through the whole catalogue and try to put aside the rise tinted glasses for the more divisive releases to see if there are still as good as I feel they are.
I hope the gig is brilliant.
Yes am looking forward to it. The Gathering Wilderness for me is still the best.
I went from loving everything up to The Gathering Wilderness to not buying a single album after it. Did the same thing with Behemoth. I think it says more about my changing tastes than their output.
They are playing local to me next month, so like Andy, I'll have to take a stab at their last few albums and give them another go. I didn't really bother with the last one after being uninspired by 'Where Greater Men Have Fallen'. but absolutely need to give them another go.
They'll be playing with Sacramentum who will be playing all of 'Far Away from the Sun' and for once, I kind of wish Primordial would deliver a full set of oldies as well. Alas, I reckon we'll get a raft of newer cuts and just a morsel or two from 'Spirit...' or 'Journey's End'. I know I'll enjoy the set more if I do take the time to spin the newer stuff.
Quote from: hellfire on September 16, 2022, 10:30:32 AMI went from loving everything up to The Gathering Wilderness to not buying a single album after it. Did the same thing with Behemoth. I think it says more about my changing tastes than their output.
ha exact same as my self!
Alan just released a podcast about To the Nameless Dead. I had it on the other day in the car. I loved it when it came out and it was exciting at the time to see Primordial jump up to another level. I think it still holds up as a strong album in its own right but it set the tone for the following two albums- Redemption and Greater Men...- which saw them get stuck in a creative rut, writing songs for festivals rather than for albums. I ended up with mixed feelings about the album for that reason, but it's hard to argue with some of the songs.
In his podcast of late Alan has been hinting at the band possibly entering its final years of activity. There seems to be a real sense of disillusion around everything, something most of us can probably connect with after two or more years of Covid lockdowns, the war in Ukraine, imminent recession and whatever other issues are currently causing the world to seem a little more grim these days. The up side is that he appears to be rethinking his approach to writing, his reasons and motivations for doing so, and it makes me think we might get a good dark album from them next. As much as I enjoyed Exile I'm not interested in hearing them repeat that formula; I would much prefer to see them draw from the obscure ends of their earlier material- Storm Before Calm and backwards. What are the chances??
Isn't he just the lyricist singer? I always thought the guitarist, bass player and drummer were central to the type of riffs and overall sound they had earlier on.
The Gathering wilderness was the last of the old sound, everything after that is based around his plaintive wailing about this and that. Boring as fuck.
Something caustic is needed.
The big big festival songs are at saturation point for me. The last couple of albums have their moments but I feel something full of piss and vinegar is needed to give them a lift.
Will we get it?
I agree he repeats himself albeit not in a direct way about the band not having much more left in the tank.
I hope they put out a record worthy of their past before they decide to call it a day.
In that podcast he was going on about The Gathering Wilderness not sounding great. I think that's a brilliant sounding album.
According to himself he is very hands on with what ends up on the finished product mix wise. I'd say Ciarán has the final say over everything. He seems like a quiet sort but absolutely rules the roost.
AA does go on a bit.
Those old riffs that build and build, that was the signature sound.
TGW hasn't a great sound, I'd agree with him there, it's an American metal blade sound. Probably compressed with low dynamic range or something?
The hammerheart rec releases beat it hands down.
I've said it to him many times online and in person, but I just cannot fathom (hoho!) his gripe with the sound of The Gathering Wilderness. That kind of uniqueness is what stands the test of time. The sound of that album exists on that album and that album alone. I can only imagine the album suffering if it had production more like the albums that followed it. Whatever about what else he's saying, holding on to that idea in his head would indicate to me that they won't attempt to dig into those particularly liminal, diffuse, bitterly melancholic vibes.
Quote from: Eoin McLove on November 26, 2022, 07:57:27 AMThe up side is that he appears to be rethinking his approach to writing, his reasons and motivations for doing so, and it makes me think we might get a good dark album from them next. As much as I enjoyed Exile I'm not interested in hearing them repeat that formula; I would much prefer to see them draw from the obscure ends of their earlier material- Storm Before Calm and backwards. What are the chances??
From listening to his podcast, I get the idea that he would channel his energy into an (final?) album that is defiant more than dark. How to translate that "defiance" into music is anyones guess but I would predict Exile 2.0, a bit of everything to finish things off.
I think the stylistic shift began on The Gathering Wilderness. Alan's vocals certainly changed on that one, but the music too in some hard to pin point way. I love that album and I think they fluked out on getting such a raw and dismal production. It's a one off album in some ways, but as I've mentioned earlier in this thread, The Coffin Ships haunted them for a few albums. I wish they hadn't attempted to rewrite that song and left it as a unique oddity*, but sure...
I would love to hear a long, sprawling record like Spirit the Earth Aflame again, with that solemn and powerful singing Alan used to do. No choruses, no concession to the crowd, just dark majesty. Dreaming :laugh:
* maybe a "one off ballad" is closer to the mark.
We'll see. It'd absolutely be the best time to do it, if closing a final chapter is in the air. That would mean an impending end to live performance too, so no need to appeal directly to that dimension. Not that I think, for me personally, that trend is what didn't work for me about the more recent albums. It was something else. Though maybe related to the implicit sense in which a song written for a crowd is perhaps necessarily going to be less introspective, less broody, and thus less apt for such lyrics and vocal attack. Biting bleak isolation as an aul slán libh, yizzer are on yer own from here on out.
I can't imagine they would lose their fan base, or much of it, by releasing something more challenging at this point. You can't turn back the clock either which is why I know my hopes will never exactly come to fruition, but I'm sure that they have it in them to maybe reinvent their sound again. Part of what makes the earlier phase of their career (pre- Spirit really) so intriguing to me is the mixture of gloomy doom, black metal and gothic sounds mixed with their Irish trad-ish style. There's quite a lot to draw from. As they progressed they streamlined the sound so much that many of those colours were washed out of the mix. Could we hear them creep back in in some new form? Now that would be interesting. Reining in Alan's high pitched butchery* might be another herculean task, however :laugh:
* it works in small doses to be fair.
I also look forward to the Arcane Sun and Geasa reunions. I can't imagine myself thinking that a year ago but I have become a little bit obsessed with Angel's Cry over the past year.
Quote from: Eoin McLove on November 26, 2022, 09:08:59 PMI also look forward to the Arcane Sun and Geasa reunions. I can't imagine myself thinking that a year ago but I have become a little bit obsessed with Angel's Cry over the past year.
Are these on the cards?
One offs, or proper reunions?
Quote from: jobrok1 on November 27, 2022, 08:45:39 AMQuote from: Eoin McLove on November 26, 2022, 09:08:59 PMI also look forward to the Arcane Sun and Geasa reunions. I can't imagine myself thinking that a year ago but I have become a little bit obsessed with Angel's Cry over the past year.
Are these on the cards?
One offs, or proper reunions?
:laugh: just me acting the cunt. Apologies!
His high pitched butchery as it's being referred to is one of his things now.
He constantly calls himself a singer in a heavy metal band.
He also loves that drawn out vocal performance that falls in or around the guitar melody being played.
Whilst for me it worked well on TTHD and Redemption he is almost like a fighter that scored a knock out and is hunting for that same killer blow since.
I'll buy whatever they put out next but will it be a dust collector? I still sometimes get lost in The Coffin Ships as it's so powerful.
I wonder if the others in the band long for him to drop the near Hetfieldisms.
They seem to pull the crowds to their sets on the festival circuit so who knows!!
On a less cynical note it might simply be that that style holds little interest or inspiration for him these days. Either way, it'll at least be interesting to see what comes next with himself hinting towards writing something less tailored to the stage.
Has anyone heard his new BM project? Is he the singer or hammering the bass?
Yes. He plays bass and does vocals.
Thanks. Maybe it will spur him onto something wild with Primordial.
QuoteAlan just released a podcast about To the Nameless Dead. I had it on the other day in the car. I loved it when it came out and it was exciting at the time to see Primordial jump up to another level. I think it still holds up as a strong album in its own right but it set the tone for the following two albums- Redemption and Greater Men...- which saw them get stuck in a creative rut, writing songs for festivals rather than for albums. I ended up with mixed feelings about the album for that reason, but it's hard to argue with some of the songs.
Must check out that podcast, and totally agree with everything you've said there, I rarely if ever revisit those records and my interest in their output waned around then. Exile did something to steer the ship in a better direction though the album is fairly patchy with very few moments that make the hairs on the back of your neck stand as they should listening to a Primordial album.
QuoteIn his podcast of late Alan has been hinting at the band possibly entering its final years of activity. There seems to be a real sense of disillusion around everything, something most of us can probably connect with after two or more years of Covid lockdowns, the war in Ukraine, imminent recession and whatever other issues are currently causing the world to seem a little more grim these days. The up side is that he appears to be rethinking his approach to writing, his reasons and motivations for doing so, and it makes me think we might get a good dark album from them next. As much as I enjoyed Exile I'm not interested in hearing them repeat that formula; I would much prefer to see them draw from the obscure ends of their earlier material- Storm Before Calm and backwards. What are the chances??
I think the odds of them drawing from the obscure ends of earlier albums are slim, and nor would I want them to do that myself. They are a band that looks forward and I think they still have another great record in them - and there has to be more options musically than drawing from the past or mining the same territory they're currently in.
Going to listen to the podcast now, if the implication is there that the next record might be the last I'd be ok with that, they've given us some back catalogue!
Quote from: Eoin McLove on November 27, 2022, 08:56:04 AM:laugh: just me acting the cunt. Apologies!
You Prick!!! :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Well, the podcast was certainly interesting. Great to hear some of the nuggets about the recording process, surprised to hear that even at that stage on Metal Blade they were still recording without a click track. It's definitely one of many elements that sets them apart, their records are always very natural sounding.
It was slightly more disturbing to hear that they were actually blatantly making a concerted effort to write songs for festivals with big choruses etc - that it was the mindset approaching the material, it may have worked on Nameless the subsequent albums draw from the same formula with less musical substance.
A couple of things made me recall the first interview I ever heard with the band which was on the 2FM metal show with John Kenny around the time of Journey's end, as a youngster everything they said on that interview spoke to me. Journey's End sounded like nothing else I'd heard at the time and the guys were on about forging your own musical path and not reading rubbish mainstream publications like Kerrang. So it's still weird to hear Alan talk about events like Graspop or writing a hit metal song for a festival because all I can think of is seeing the band play in Slattery's, it doesn't matter where I've seen them since - that's my overriding and stand out memory of the band. It was like the time they were looking for votes for some Metal Hammer award, part of me is delighted for them because they deserve every success they've gotten but the youth in me dies a bit. I guess at some stage life enters as a factor for all bands, it's different when you're at the beginning and writing for yourselves. When you've gone up a few levels as Primordial have you want to maintain it and ultimately some aspect of the music gets sacrificed.
QuoteThe up side is that he appears to be rethinking his approach to writing, his reasons and motivations for doing so
This was encouraging, and I remain hopeful that the next record will truly deliver the goods. They owe us nothing really, as I said earlier it's an incredible back catalogue by anyone's standards.
All true. I must have heard that interview on the Metal Show because I listened to it religiously but I can't remember it. Maybe I missed it. I'm not sure I'd have loved A Journey's End when it came out because everything I love about it now would have probably made it too difficult and obscure for me to get into back then. But who knows, it might have clicked.
As for your earlier comment about not wanting to see them return to the roots, as it were, I agree with your reasoning. I know it's impossible for them to recapture that same vibe for many reasons, not least of all because they are more competent musicians now than they were, but that said, I would love to hear some of the earlier elements that were faded out post-Storm Before Calm creep back in in some new way. They are probably all still there already, I'm just hearing too much other new elements in the mix to notice :laugh:
Lads ye know more about Primordial than I'll ever know but I think for the nameless dead is great. The gathering wilderness tops it for Mr though.
They have enough festival friendly big chorus songs. TGW and TTND churned out enough and arguably the best of these.
Everything since has been of little interest to me, personnally. And would prefer they leave all that behind and move on a bit.
They need to get back to making something more honest with some real fire in it's belly. So maybe going back to revisit some of their past glories for the next album is what's needed to inspire them to make something more inovative again down the line.
Alan's long had apparent difficulty in reconciling, on the one hand, the expected underground call to reject all that is mainstream with, on the other hand, the desire to actively appeal to as wide an audience as possible. So, you'd see him giving out about people filming on mobile phones during concerts, but then posting videos of performances of theirs recorded from the audience on a mobile phone. Or railing against Spotify, but then openly advertising their presence on Spotify. Telling people for years that the spirit of metal is X, Y, Z but then doing the opposite because, well, AC/DC and Iron Maiden have street cred too and they wrote crowd pleasers. There's a tension there between two worlds, pulling in opposite directions, but so far that tension hasn't proved a creative one. Which would require a way of reconciling the two. So, either they try to do that. Or they embrace one of those worlds fully. Or they release another album that follows in the vein of sitting a little bit uncomfortably between the two.
Yep, that's a good way of putting it.
And, the podcast made me think Primordial are not the only ones that have that difficulty. I was thinking recently the same goes for Behemoth, although for me a band that are currently not fit to be mentioned in the same breath as Primordial. They've gone completely pantomime, a far cry from their black metal roots or even the early death metal period. It seems like every ounce of their material has to involve crowd participation and so little of what they play is live. I've seen footage of their tour rehearsals and there's so much stuff piped in through the PA. Nergal is kind of similar to Alan in respects to the points you've made about Spotify etc. Urging fans to rebel against religion, the state etc on one had yet narking on people for not taking their vaccine - that's rock and roll for you.
A bit of a tangent maybe but definitely a topic worth discussing, and I get it with those bands - they've all done their time and toiled away for years, something has to give at some stage.
TTND perfected their style at that point and is still their most accessible album. But Redemption felt forced and never really held my interest.
I don't get the disparagement for WGMHF though. Admittedly it's more of a compilation of songs than a coherent album, but there are four very good songs in there and the others are OK. Quite a bit of classic rock influence in a couple of the tracks which would have been interesting to pursue.
Exile sounded more coherent than anything since TTND but I've never played it more than a few times though it is a good album still.
Reading through these past few pages has me itching to have another play through the catalogue despite just recently doing so.
It's a good back and forth to have going on, it shows there is still quite a level of respect and care for the band.
He hammered home the pride he still has in TTND on the podcast and taking it at face value it is a fantastic album.
It really stands up to other bands output that are in or around that level and beyond.
I sincerely doubt Alan has any interest or intention of revisiting a more underground sound. For him the album is a necessary evil to get out and do festivals, and if releasing an album with a couple of Empire Falls songs on it lets him go to far off places and play live then fine.
I've no problem with that attitude myself, he's aware it's the autumn of the band at best now and just wants to enjoy it.
Exile Amongst the Ruins has become one of my favourite Primordial albums.
Quote from: Cailleach on November 28, 2022, 09:52:18 PMExile Amongst the Ruins has become one of my favourite Primordial albums.
Me too surprisingly. It's like their version of Iron Maiden's Killers - it doesn't have the stand out songs of other albums but sounds great and way more consistent than the 2 records before. The risks also paid off in doing a couple of atypical songs.
I'll have to give it a proper go, by the sounds of it.
Never really gave it a chance after the two before it.
I have Exile in the car stereo. Must give it a spin
Quote from: jpm4 on November 28, 2022, 10:05:36 PMQuote from: Cailleach on November 28, 2022, 09:52:18 PMExile Amongst the Ruins has become one of my favourite Primordial albums.
Me too surprisingly. It's like their version of Iron Maiden's Killers - it doesn't have the stand out songs of other albums but sounds great and way more consistent than the 2 records before. The risks also paid off in doing a couple of atypical songs.
That's it exactly. It is one of those album that grows on you.
What pod does AA talk about the band maybe looking towards the end?
I listened to the TTND one mentioned and it's not on that I think?
Just on his pod thing, there's some great snippets of info/insight here and there but he has a tendency to ramble and often says the same thing 2 or 3 times in a row. The ones where he chats with someone are best. I've only listened to the a few of them, mind.
In whichever one is before the TTND one he mentions it. Check the podcast number and work back.
Gave Exiled a spin for the first time in ages thanks to the waffle here, I have to concur with some of the above comments, it's a good, coherent record without needing a 'dah-ancing at Sintraaa' or whatever as an earworm.
I have a few days off and its fuckin' freezing out so I'm going to settle in for an evening or two with Alan and friends, send the young lad to his room with a few sambos and his iPad.
I enjoy his podcast. Yes he rambles on a bit but interesting all the same.
Exile is a great album,best thing they've released in years.
Ya Exile is class, havent spun it in a while but will tonight
I had Imrama on in the car this morning and I had Borknagar's debut on yesterday. I noticed a similarity here and there in a couple of the ideas that had never occurred to me before. Coincidence or influence?
That Borknagar CD is my favourite album of all time in spite of its flaws, but I've never made any connection with Imrama. Please elaborate Monsieur Coooning'am :)
There's an acoustic song on the Borknagar album with a kind of clanky off kilter riff towards the end. I think it was the 7th or 8th song on Imrama had a very similar thing going on underneath the main electric riff that jumped out as being very similar. There's also another section with a nod, shall we say, to early Enslaved in one song (can't remember song titles for the life of me any more) where they utilise those sharp stabbing synths. No complaint from me, I fully intend to rip that off myself at some point 8)
Great band but Alan Averill is Irish Metal's Bono :laugh:
He might let you stay in the west wing of his abode.
Primordial's next album gonna be called Vico Road.
Quote from: livingabortion on December 08, 2022, 12:19:16 AMGreat band but Alan Averill is Irish Metal's Bono :laugh:
Only one way to decide... Primordial vs U2 in a no holds barred, shirts vs. skins, deathmatch.
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTa40x1xzjaK_FWdfp2aSXAeo5XWCTFgfOi7g&usqp=CAU)
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Quote from: livingabortion on December 08, 2022, 12:19:16 AMGreat band but Alan Averill is Irish Metal's Bono :laugh:
I can't wait for his autobiography
Quote from: livingabortion on December 08, 2022, 12:19:16 AMGreat band but Alan Averill is Irish Metal's Bono :laugh:
Funny about that comparison. I was thinking actually there's a possible comparison to be made with Lizzy in terms of Primordial's studio output. First few albums quite different in sound (more so in Lizzy's case) but with elements of the later work in place, plus more obviously Irish cultural references in the music/lyrics. Then you get about 5/6 albums in and the sound streamlines and evolves. TTND is Primordial's Jailbreak when you think about it. Less idiosyncratic but more accessible and really darn consistent.
In his recent podcast Alan mentions that Primordial are aiming to have a new album out by around September, in time for their tour with Paradise Lost. I was hoping he might give a few hints as to what kind of direction the songs are taking but he is giving little away. Still, good to know they are in the thick of writing and lets hope some/lots of that darkness and bitterness that he had hinted at in recent times manifests itself into something novel.
Quote from: Necro Red on December 17, 2022, 07:36:37 PMQuote from: livingabortion on December 08, 2022, 12:19:16 AMGreat band but Alan Averill is Irish Metal's Bono :laugh:
I can't wait for his autobiography
from what i heard you wont have to wait long
Quote from: Cosmic_Equilibrium on January 20, 2023, 11:41:12 PMFunny about that comparison. I was thinking actually there's a possible comparison to be made with Lizzy in terms of Primordial's studio output. First few albums quite different in sound (more so in Lizzy's case) but with elements of the later work in place, plus more obviously Irish cultural references in the music/lyrics. Then you get about 5/6 albums in and the sound streamlines and evolves. TTND is Primordial's Jailbreak when you think about it. Less idiosyncratic but more accessible and really darn consistent.
If the next album is to be there last and it turns out to be their Thunder & Lightning, then that would be awesome :laugh: :abbath:
Quote from: Shitstirrer on January 25, 2023, 02:23:54 PMQuote from: Necro Red on December 17, 2022, 07:36:37 PMQuote from: livingabortion on December 08, 2022, 12:19:16 AMGreat band but Alan Averill is Irish Metal's Bono :laugh:
I can't wait for his autobiography
from what i heard you wont have to wait long
ah no ha ha ha. I was only messing
I see Primordial have pulled out of Hammerfest,sounds like its not the first time HF have tried to screw a band over!
I don't know what it is about the genre and sham festivals. Manorfest was similar last year right? And just thinking, that Clang farce finally went quietly into the night recently enough. Maybe worthy of a topic in itself, we've had a decent amount of half-cooked hair brained festivals on this island too, Philfest and Mysterious Wounds spring to mind but I'm sure there were many many more.........
Sometimes I look at these lineups and wonder how the fuck a "promotor" would ever think their costs would be covered, then you've the aftermath like with Overkill last year having to cancel a tour because Manorfest was pulled.
Did Clang happen, that was Coroner and Candlemass, wasn't it?
No, never happened. It was an obnoxious proposition to begin with, I think the craziest aspect was they dug in and kept rescheduling it with different bands when they could've easily just cancelled once things went south with the pandemic - easy out. I mean they must've sold fuck all tickets.
The treatment of the Irish bands was ridiculous too, I know two of the bands that were on the initial bill and it was $200 fee for all bands + beer etc then after several rejigs he said he was cutting the Irish acts altogether only to replace them with different ones. Can only imagine what went on with the headliners. It was cancelled late last year I think but it was done very very quietly.
Was that Clang fest ment to be in the middle of nowhere too?;or am I thinking of another fest?
Looks like loads of bands have pulled out of Hammerfest!,not just Primordial.
Clang was to be in the National Concert Hall, if memory serves. You might be thinking of the Iron Mountain Fest.
Looks like they're dropping like flies...
(https://scontent.fdub5-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/329871348_3434437860162747_5936094863497061922_n.jpg?_nc_cat=109&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=pBUKc2mWN1UAX9BhV7A&_nc_ht=scontent.fdub5-2.fna&oh=00_AfDwkK8mDzfV3IXx1NbNJs4D80OeSE4J40eJ9l3w_Wklrw&oe=63E95156)
Clang was to be in the National Arena not the NCH
Indeed.
Primordial are/were recently in the studio recording a new album and I'm actually anticipating it a lot after the surprising creative success of Exile Amongst the Ruins. It's slightly mind boggling to think that it has been five years since that album came out. How??? In anticipation of the new album I fired on Exile earlier and it really holds up with time. Arguably incoherent in terms of style, it kind of veers all over the place, but the songs are all so good it works in spite of that fact. I'm sure I'm not the only one who would love to hear a regressive album from Primordial, something that harkens back to the dark majesty of Spirit the Earth Aflame for example, but let's be realistic, that's never going to happen. That said, I'm hoping for something moody, dark and interesting and with the amount of ideas they managed to pump into Exile, who knows, they may well surprise us again.
He said on the last podcast that they are trying to get back to that style.
Apparently the band don't want his lyrics to follow the same vein as the last few, they want something to deal with the mythology.
How they do it remains to be seen.
Hopefully it will be new and not a retread.
Sounds good to me. The geopolitics is kind of boring at this stage. He got away from that on Exile and, actually, something I noticed while listening again today was something that had been discussed earlier in the thread. A lot of the clean vocal parts on Exile were less gravelly than the previous several albums and kind of had more in common with his old style of singing.
It feels like after To The Nameless when they hit the bigger stages he adopted a role of a bigger headline frontman role.
There is a lot of music that and I imagine he has to fill it with something over just standing there.
That big singing woah oh style took more of a role as well.
From all he has said we could be in for something special.
I'm sure I am miles off but I hope not.
The riffs have to be there as well.
Please let there be riffs.
I stuck on Where Greater Men Have Fallen here for the first time in years. I only have this and Redemption on vinyl. I was never bothered buying the CD of either as they never did a lot for me but maybe a reassessment nine years on will alter my opinion of this one. Redemption remains a write off. Oh, I love the artwork. Pity they didn't use this on the next album which is so much better musically but visually dull.
The title track is a cracking opener- a real first in the air live ripper.
Babel's Tower is a trudge for me. The vocal melodies (if you could call them that) are tuneless and hard on the ear. I like the noodly guitar bit at the end though.
Come the Flood on now. Again, for me the vocals fall flat in the verses. The chorus is decent in an understated way, but the plodding music is hard to get thrilled by.
The Seed of Tyrants (the song titles have become a bit of an interchangeable blur across the last few albums) is off to a good start. High energy and reminiscent of Heretic's Age from the mighty Calm Before Storm. I like Alan's gruff vocals here. Not overly concerning himself with melody, rather letting a bit of aggression come back in. Not a classic, but decent.
Ghosts of the Charnel House. This is alright. Kind of hinted at some of the hard rock inspired parts that they did more convincingly on the next album. Not bad but not exactly brilliant.
The Alchemist's Head. Easily the best song the band has written in several long years. Beats everything else here and smashes everything on Redemption too. So dark, ominous, vicious, unpredictable and exciting with a blood curdling vocal attack that has been missing far too long. A cool evocative title for a cool evocative song. I would love the next album to have more of this type of thing.
Born to Night. I can't remember anything about this song but the intro is working for me. Solitary atmospheric guitar playing reminiscent of The Hosting of the Sidhe. I always liked the instrumental songs on the old albums... It has just gotten heavy and the riff is fucking good! Oh wait, this is the Black Rose one. The obvious nod to Thin Lizzy kind of takes the wind out of its sails; they should have built on their own cool opening heavy riff maybe. Not a bad old dittie despite the homage.
Wield Lightning to Split the Sun. Typical Primordial style with that swinging rhythm they are fond of, but more energetic than a couple of the earlier efforts of the album. Alan's vocals are good here too. Pitched more in the mid range to lower range which gives the ears a break from the high pitched yodelling. A good ending.
Far better than Redemption overall but at the time it hadn't enough positives to get me excited. I felt I was done with Primordial but then Exile Amongst the Ruins kicked my hoop. This is definitely better than I remembered even if it shows a band not entirely out of the doldrums.
Quotea real first in the air live ripper
For me ; Nameless, Redemption and Greater all bogged down by tracks that fall into that category. I find those albums incredibly difficult to return to on a regular basis. I do enjoy some of the tracks when they're performed live but when I'm listening at home it all seems a bit plastic, not what I want from Primordial at all.
Both Redemption and Greater Men are difficult listens, IMO.
As you said, Redemption looks fantastic, but I still haven't listened to it since it's release.
Greater Men though, I have tried to warm more to. but still not sold on it.
Exile... I haven't even given much thought to as I was so underwhelmed be the previous couple of efforts.
Been meaning to give it a go on positive comments about it on here.
For the record, I like the artwork for Where Greater Men Have Fallen. Not really into the artwork for Redemption at the Puritan's Hand.
Despite my fairly harsh overview of those two albums, the only reason I'm revisiting them is because I'm actually highly anticipating the new album.
Redemption is a brilliant album, I'm sure I've said that before. I love the artwork as well.
The one thing I don't like is going for the big fuck off opener for the first song.
It sounds forced and there for the purpose of being bang bang here we are rather than being there as a great song.
Quote from: Eoin McLove on April 04, 2023, 08:30:29 AMI stuck on Where Greater Men Have Fallen here for the first time in years. I only have this and Redemption on vinyl. I was never bothered buying the CD of either as they never did a lot for me but maybe a reassessment nine years on will alter my opinion of this one. Redemption remains a write off. Oh, I love the artwork. Pity they didn't use this on the next album which is so much better musically but visually dull.
The title track is a cracking opener- a real first in the air live ripper.
Babel's Tower is a trudge for me. The vocal melodies (if you could call them that) are tuneless and hard on the ear. I like the noodly guitar bit at the end though.
Come the Flood on now. Again, for me the vocals fall flat in the verses. The chorus is decent in an understated way, but the plodding music is hard to get thrilled by.
The Seed of Tyrants (the song titles have become a bit of an interchangeable blur across the last few albums) is off to a good start. High energy and reminiscent of Heretic's Age from the mighty Calm Before Storm. I like Alan's gruff vocals here. Not overly concerning himself with melody, rather letting a bit of aggression come back in. Not a classic, but decent.
Ghosts of the Charnel House. This is alright. Kind of hinted at some of the hard rock inspired parts that they did more convincingly on the next album. Not bad but not exactly brilliant.
The Alchemist's Head. Easily the best song the band has written in several long years. Beats everything else here and smashes everything on Redemption too. So dark, ominous, vicious, unpredictable and exciting with a blood curdling vocal attack that has been missing far too long. A cool evocative title for a cool evocative song. I would love the next album to have more of this type of thing.
Born to Night. I can't remember anything about this song but the intro is working for me. Solitary atmospheric guitar playing reminiscent of The Hosting of the Sidhe. I always liked the instrumental songs on the old albums... It has just gotten heavy and the riff is fucking good! Oh wait, this is the Black Rose one. The obvious nod to Thin Lizzy kind of takes the wind out of its sails; they should have built on their own cool opening heavy riff maybe. Not a bad old dittie despite the homage.
Wield Lightning to Split the Sun. Typical Primordial style with that swinging rhythm they are fond of, but more energetic than a couple of the earlier efforts of the album. Alan's vocals are good here too. Pitched more in the mid range to lower range which gives the ears a break from the high pitched yodelling. A good ending.
Far better than Redemption overall but at the time it hadn't enough positives to get me excited. I felt I was done with Primordial but then Exile Amongst the Ruins kicked my hoop. This is definitely better than I remembered even if it shows a band not entirely out of the doldrums.
It's a long time since I listened but I'm sorta nodding my head along with the praise of the standout tracks - the others are just part of that forgettable album mulch that's been on everything since TTND.
Your love of Exile is interesting too, I must give it a go proper. I was tapped out that stage.
Storm Before Calm on in the car earlier. Sun's First Rays is a little beaut and then into Sons of the Morrigan. What a song.
Spirit The Earth A Flame is the one I most come back to listing to. I find the albums can be a bit of a slog to get through. It has been awhile since I've listened to one straight through now
I'd have a lot of fondness for Spirit too. It's the album that introduced me to the underground back in the day.
That last gig they played in Dublin was top tier I must say. One of the best performances of theirs that I've seen to date.
Also, I'll be heading to Beyond the Gates in Norway in August where they're playing The Gathering Wilderness in its entirety. Very much looking forward to that.
Oh niiice, that'll be lethal.
Spirit and Storm absolutely rock da teach.
Lost all interest with Redemption though.
Only picked up WGMHF maybe last year as it was on special with Seasons of Mist and wouldn't have bothered otherwise. Can't say I've listened to it much since.
I've been told to give Exiles a chance, so maybe I will do eventually, it's only been 5 years like...
Just checked Wiki - Mick left this year??
What?? That's news to me too :o
I was wondering why there was zero mention of him in the studio clips on AA's instagram. Footage of Ciarán at work but no Mick.
Thee must be a sex scandal.
Does anyone know why MetalArchives is no longer listing Micheál as a member of the band? Is he really gone?
He does indeed seem to be gone, not in any promotional photos or social media etc. I'm sure they'll announce in due course, he's been with them so long.
It seems Sean from last light has been filling in for some gigs.
Still no official word on the line up status.
No album title or artwork released yet. I'm hoping for something a bit different at this point but let's see. Visually there has been a kind of similarishness to the last couple of albums. I'm dreaming, I know, but it would be cool to see them go for an old painting or even a new bespoke painting to spice things up.
Interesting remark about the artwork, aside from some of the latterday records having a musical formula, I find I'm continually mixing the albums up and part of the reason is the artwork itself. Lots of statues and similar colours make it hard to differentiate
Exactly. In fairness they developed a unique identity on that front within the pagan metal scene, but it's time for something new methinks.
Paul McCarroll has already said in another thread that the artwork is done. So it won't be an old painting. I've no idea what the collaborative creative process is (ie how much the band input) between band and Paul though.
Not an official announcement but they said on Instagram their new album will be out before they tour with PL at the end of September.
No way! That's only round the corner !
Anyone have any other info on Mick leaving the band? Seems to be complete radio silence on it.
Nothing was said at all.
I'd have to presume it was amicable. It looks like Sean from last light has been filling in for some shows.
Micks been leaving for about a decade now! :laugh:
I'm just listening to Alan's newest podcast here, procrastinating from work of course, but he mentions the new album is out Sep 12 and is called "How It Ends".
That's in next to no time. I imagine a big announcement is only around the corner. Intrigued as to how this one will play especially with Alan's vocal performance on Verminous Serpent, wonder if it will have any influence.
How it Ends is a cool title.
I thought so too. And of course it raises eyebrows...
Quote from: Thorn on July 26, 2023, 09:18:44 AMI thought so too. And of course it raises eyebrows...
Well they can lower that eyebrow by mentioning a fondness for the words resurrection...return...phoenix park, you know, the usuals!
Going to buck the trend and say I don't like the title. Seems a bit low brow and obvious for Primordial. Maybe because I've heard it used in many other songs/albums and that ridiculous track of the same name by Red Hot Chili Peppers is what immediately sprung to mind.
Maybe it'll click when I see the artwork and get to hear what direction they've gone in musically.
Yep, it's a lazy, uninspired title to me.
Years ago I would have agreed but I like the stark, brutal reality of it now, eschewing all mysticism and esotericism and saying, yeah, this is where we're at now, come at us, Let's light this pyre once more.
Yep, I agree. Simple and to the point.
The End Complete rework perhaps?
Exactly what I was thinking from the off!
If they are hinting at at 'the end', as in wrapping up the band, I think a self-titled album would have been cool, I don't mind How it Ends though, it does stick out in their discography, but whether that's a good or bad thing depends on how the album turns out I suppose.
A Journey's End came to mind for me. Maybe it'll tie in to their early sound.
It very to the point for them if it is the end of the road for them.
It's a great way to build up some genuine excitement for whatever they put out. I can't wait to hear the first single. The video has been filmed already.
Quote from: Eoin McLove on July 27, 2023, 08:41:01 PMA Journey's End came to mind for me. Maybe it'll tie in to their early sound.
Mmm is say that ship has sailed
One can hope.
I'm just excited to hear some new Primordial.
True. The last album was so good, so I'm excited either way.
Echoing the above comment , their last album has grown to become one of my favourites now. Whatever the direction they choose to go in, I am just looking forward to hearing their new material. I hope it's not the end, though.
Playing McHughs in Drogheda in Sept as a tour warm up, not been there in years - will be cool to see Primordial in a venue like that, tickets only €16.
Yeah, saw that on FB and was thinking it sounded like a golden opportunity of a once off in a venue like those they started out in!
Shame it's in Drogheda, but what can you do
Ah Ciaran, do you remember that time in the chippers in Balbriggan..... the barney with the travellers!
Ha ha ha! jaysus thats a while ago now!!!!
Yes Drogheda.....see you there! Al Bell, guaranteed!
Hmmmm, might hit that for the craic. What's the venue like?
Must be getting close to hearing a single from the new album.
I heard a few tracks but I genuinely can't remember them. Happy to help.
Quote from: open face surgery on August 04, 2023, 12:04:09 PMHmmmm, might hit that for the craic. What's the venue like?
Its a good venue and the pub its part of is rocking... literally. A metal institution in Drogheda.
My anticipation of this is surprisingly high. I'm dying to hear a new song. I've been pretty obsessed with Primordial the past couple of years, all their albums. I think the last one, Exile, is savage; the title track & To Hell or the Hangman are brilliant. If the album is really coming out in just over a month, I'm surprised there isn't a song out yet or even the album announcement....cutting it a little fine no?
I think I'm gonna make it up to this "warm up" gig in Drogheda. Just in case they don't play again here at home for a while.
Quote from: open face surgery on August 04, 2023, 12:04:09 PMHmmmm, might hit that for the craic. What's the venue like?
It is decent enough. Big enough as well I would guess it holds between 200 - 300 or maybe even more. Have an outdoor area at the back as well that started offering loads of different types of food once the pubs opened back up again.
Quote from: mishima on April 05, 2023, 09:15:37 PMAlso, I'll be heading to Beyond the Gates in Norway in August where they're playing The Gathering Wilderness in its entirety. Very much looking forward to that.
So yeah, it was To The Nameless Dead that they played.. Got my wires crossed somehow. They did finish with The Coffin Ships though..
Class to see them in Grieghallen, despite the sound issues at the beginning.
Ger from Mael Mordha was on guitar duties, btw.
The TTND songs lend themselves better to a festival but I'd have been very, very disappointed with that, had I expected TGW in full. I'd love to hear End of all Times live.
TGW is 20 soon enough, as mental as that is, so it may happen.
A month out from the release and no sign of artwork or a sample yet. I wonder are they going to forego any sort of build up and just release the first single on the day of the album release. While there's a part of me dying to hear something and see the artwork I think there might be something simple, understated and refreshing about that approach.
New song tomorrow at 9am...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DxeZbd2QbAw
:laugh: sure there you go!
Hmmm. Not into the artwork but maybe it'll grow on me. I'll give the song a couple more spins and see if it works but it is a bit unremarkable on first listen.
Sounds very Sons of the Morrigany.
Quote from: Eoin McLove on August 16, 2023, 05:57:58 AMHmmm. Not into the artwork but maybe it'll grow on me.
I saw it pop up on Spotify this morning before I put my glasses on and all I could think was "is this supposed to be a farmer about to shoot a pigeon circling overhead?"
The album is called "How it ends" so?Jesus that sounds ominous
Apparently the image is from the Farmers Journal. Definitely an odd choice but it might make more sense in context of the songs. It's not the most eye catching design though.
I gave the song a second go and liked it more. It's textbook Primordial with few surprises but it's catchy.
It's like Primordial gone full classic rock. So far so good.
Ya, strong Lizzy vibes. I like it. The doubling of the vocals in the early verse is cool.
Where are ye hearing it lads? The Youtube link there is telling me it's premiering at 5pm.
Quote from: Carnage on August 16, 2023, 11:01:50 AMWhere are ye hearing it lads? The Youtube link there is telling me it's premiering at 5pm.
Spotify ->
https://open.spotify.com/track/3TPwFwO6oPMpiVSZizxcyk?si=ebcab8c1c6ef4007
Its on Alan's YouTube as well already. I presume the "premiere" later is a video for it rather than just the track alone.
I like it - as said Lizzy influences to the forefront. Took a while to come around to 'To Hell or the Hangman' when that first came out but this is more immediate, can see it doing very well live.
Yep, sounds like Lizzy and Gary Moore...i'm all for it
I dunno lads, it's dull as dishwater to my ears. If the style is to remain very similar to TTND 15 years on, it's undeniable that this song wouldn't haven't gotten close to being on that record. Sometimes these songs fit better in the context of an album, but this is stagnant, by the numbers stuff for me. Definitely hear the SOTM comparison and the Thin Lizzy buzz, but I don't really see that as new.
Had my Bingo Card ready when I heard "funeral pyre' in the opening lyrics, was waiting on "wounded animal" and "brothers" for the house.
Cover artwork is naff.
Hope the songs are good. That's all that matters, really.
Ah right, sound. It's alright, a bit generic sounding but he has some nice vocal flourishes, unusual for him.
His voice sounds very good. Not as forced as before.
Quote from: Squigs on August 16, 2023, 11:43:41 AMI dunno lads, it's dull as dishwater to my ears. If the style is to remain very similar to TTND 15 years on, it's undeniable that this song wouldn't haven't gotten close to being on that record.
Well it's definitely reduced my thoughts on the album taking any sort of leap out of that comfort zone. If there is somehow, darker elements to this album I'll probably find it jarring embedded with this type of song. This could well stick out as the 'single' song on the album.
I'm somewhat disappointed with it. I don't want Thin Lizzy from it, Primordial were always so unique to hear Lizzyesque pub rock in there at the beginning is kind of beneath them (I think), that whole intro section is a bit begosh begorra for me.
I think Mr Mclove got into my head too with romantic notions of return to earlier styles, I'd hoped for that myself but knew it wouldn't be the case.
And indeed throughout the thread there's been lot's of guesses from all of us as to which way it could go.
There is, however an absolutely glorious section once the acoustic guitars kick in that reminds me of Journey's end that gives me hope for the rest of the record and indeed for this track to grow after a few more spins, I just don't think I'll ever warm to that first section.
Given the song a proper listen and like it for the most part.
Reminds me of TTND, which I really like, so fine by me.
The Lizzy intro was a bit off-putting, but grew on me.
They've 'kinda' had that going for them on some of the more recent albums anyway.
I can't see the whole album sounding like this though.
For what it's worth - I saw a comment on this song on Alan's patreon page to the effect of "This is the only song on the album that sounds like Lizzy", so it's possible the rest is very different.
Yea, I found that with Where Greater Men Have Fallen - lots of the formulaic stuff that we came to expect on it, but there was a lot of attempts to create something new and out of the comfort zone.
I must go back to Exile Among The Ruins too, of all the Primordial albums it's easily the one I've spent least time with.
I see Metal Blade don't even know Mick is gone!
https://www.metalblade.com/us/news/primordial-to-release-how-it-ends-september-29th-via-metal-blade-records/
PRIMORDIAL:
A.A. Nemtheanga – vocals
Ciarán MacUilliam – guitar
Michael O'Floinn – guitar
Pól MacAmlaigh – bass
Simon O'Laoghaire – drums
Still, tis nice to be nice with a simple thank you or acknowledgement after 20 years of service.
I'll wait to see how the whole thing goes together. Interesting to see The Gathering Wilderness theme continuing for the cover at least.
Primordial Feck Off Crows.png
Journeys End..... what a time, I have the original of Imrama on CD......ah those nights of fires and cider on Barnageara Beach....
Love "Redemption at the Puritan's Hand"..... still love the track "Stolen Years" from "Exile....."
I do like the transition of this track. If there's a nod to Thin Lizzy so what.....
I like it.... lots of change since the early 90s but at least these guys are still around. Keep going is what I say.....
Sounds like a nod to Lizzy for sure but the song has grown with each listen, Nemtheanga sounds great here, really looking forward to the album now.
It's very catchy. Lots going on with the vocals. There is one thing I would love to hear and it's a ripping guitar solo.
I know there is one there but a real flying off the fretboard style solo would lift the song even more.
Regardless I'm looking forward to the full album.
That artwork is absolute dogshit, looks like something dodgy from the 90s that hasn't aged well.
Hearing running wild in that new track.
Quote from: Squigs on August 16, 2023, 11:43:41 AMI dunno lads, it's dull as dishwater to my ears. If the style is to remain very similar to TTND 15 years on, it's undeniable that this song wouldn't haven't gotten close to being on that record. Sometimes these songs fit better in the context of an album, but this is stagnant, by the numbers stuff for me. Definitely hear the SOTM comparison and the Thin Lizzy buzz, but I don't really see that as new.
Had my Bingo Card ready when I heard "funeral pyre' in the opening lyrics, was waiting on "wounded animal" and "brothers" for the house.
Agree with that, wasn't sure to laugh or turn it off when "funeral pyres" got another run....
Agree with that, wasn't sure to laugh or turn it off when "funeral pyres" got another run....
[/quote]
ha ha ..disappointed a Heathen Man of some sort didnt get a mench
Quote from: Snare on August 16, 2023, 05:26:18 PMI see Metal Blade don't even know Mick is gone!
https://www.metalblade.com/us/news/primordial-to-release-how-it-ends-september-29th-via-metal-blade-records/
PRIMORDIAL:
A.A. Nemtheanga – vocals
Ciarán MacUilliam – guitar
Michael O'Floinn – guitar
Pól MacAmlaigh – bass
Simon O'Laoghaire – drums
Still, tis nice to be nice with a simple thank you or acknowledgement after 20 years of service.
I'll wait to see how the whole thing goes together. Interesting to see The Gathering Wilderness theme continuing for the cover at least.
Primordial Feck Off Crows.png
Is that the Die-Hard edition, with the alternative album title ??!!! :laugh:
Wouldn't be gone on that but then I haven't liked a primordial album since the gathering wilderness
Quote from: Jward on August 17, 2023, 01:59:21 PMIs that the Die-Hard edition, with the alternative album title ??!!! :laugh:
That's the album teaser that comes free with the Farmer's Journal referenced by McLove.
I got a good laugh at the Bingo Card requirements for House, thanks Squigs! :laugh:
Quote from: Snare on August 17, 2023, 05:12:00 PMQuote from: Jward on August 17, 2023, 01:59:21 PMIs that the Die-Hard edition, with the alternative album title ??!!! :laugh:
That's the album teaser that comes free with the Farmer's Journal referenced by McLove.
I got a good laugh at the Bingo Card requirements for House, thanks Squigs! :laugh:
Is there an "=ation" in there?Redemption?Salvation?
The long antipated new tune hit me weird, I was so excited for it I think I expected too much, and at first was somehow left underwhelmed or something. But after 6 listens or so now and a little while to let it sink in, yeah it fucking rocks. I like it! It's definitely Primordial all over. They have a very unique and original sound/style and this song shows it fully and firmly. I'm really excited to hear the rest of the album, some of the song titles are very promising, like All Against All has to be fucking dark and heavy right?. The artwork; I don't know, not great really is it, it's certainly different which I think was needed; but it just feels a bit too simple and plain really is all. Either way, I Do like the new song, and remain hyped for the album. Ordered, along with that tshirt!
Oh yeah, seeing as no one asked or cares and fuck you, this is how I'd rate the albums meself now...
Gathering Wilderness > Nameless Dead > Storm Before Calm > Spirit The Earth > Exile Amongst > Redemption At > Where Greater > Journeys End > Dark Romanticism > Imrama
QuoteGathering Wilderness > Nameless Dead > Storm Before Calm > Spirit The Earth > Exile Amongst > Redemption At > Where Greater > Journeys End > Dark Romanticism > Imrama
Interesting rating of the albums. Some of the records you have at the end I'd have at the top (No right answer with this, unlike a Slayer or Metallica I think everyone's Primordial list would be different)
An aside, I gave Imrama a blast recently enough and while some of it is hasn't aged well, I still think parts of it hold up very well. The youthful exuberance definitely comes through at least.Different time, different band etc.
Imrama is great. Definitely a bit unrealised in terms of their own definitive style with obvious nods to influences here and there, but I love it for that too. Youthful, charming and full of atmosphere and the old logo and artwork are so cool. I would love to get some of the earlier designs on t-shirts with the very old logo and the more basic version of the later logo (before they added the stag and serpent).
Yeah, I love it too but acknowledge it isn't the fully formed article. I'd definitely throw it on more frequently than some of the more recent releases.
Did anyone ever catch them live that far back? Earliest I seen them was Journey's end, they had some miles under their belts at that stage. Just wondering what those handful of earlier shows were like.
Saw them just prior to it a few times for sure when theyd have played some of those songs, not sure if I saw them once it was released?I think punk/hc had taken over for me by then
I caught them live twice in 95 and again late 90s in Cork.I still think their peak was around 2000-2002.
Saw them a few times around that time, doing smaller/pub gigs, I think I saw them in the Temple Bar Music Centre once. Last time was an album launch downstairs in Fibbers (support was Averill, Steve Hughes and Darragh O'Laoghaire playing covers, anyone remember what year it was?) - I lasted 2 songs.
Saw them in Cork way back when and at one of the Day Of Darkness all day things. The change is palpable to the band of nowadays. Still think the new album will deliver.
The preorders have a t shirt that seem quite far removed from the album art.
Mmm still not convinced by the new song. Still will order lp
Saw them in Nancy's in Cork just after they'd signed with... Candlelight wasn't it? Whenever that was.....94? Am almost sure the show is on The somewhere.
The new song isn't great to my ears. Perhaps I just need to give it more time.
Had to wait til today to have good sound to listen to this. Not sure it was worth waiting. Definitely regret giving it its first listen along with the video, which is neither good nor bad enough. Will try to forget video by this time tomorrow and give it a listen on its own.
Yes the video is ridiculous. Like wtf is going on. Song is meh really hope album is great.
The video is like the beginning of an idea that was never developed. It's shot beautifully but it's utterly pointless. The song gets better with repeated listens but I don't really want Primordial to sound like Thin Lizzy. We'll see what the rest of the album holds.
.....the blurb at the start of the video leaves me waiting for something interesting. Then there are a few flash backs or something near the end. Swords put on a flag. No context, so my own imagination kicks in, with little further from the video, my imagination....waits....processes.....then says right back to reading "Rogue Trooper".
After a few minutes, and a second viewing..... meh, what was that about.
Now the thing here could be "personal interpretation", I can hear it now "We wanted it to be a lot of things to a lot of people" which is a cop out. Yes indeed story board explainer for the hidden message I missed, or else just tell me the rest of the story.
Well shot video in a nice spot..... Alan lets us know who he sees himself as in real life :)
Looking forward to that gig they announced earlier...support is very strong as well
Wonder who this surprise special guest is, trying to think what band could support Primordial, yet be considered 'marquee' enough to warrant a special guest announcement.
For absolutely no reason at all other than AA posted a picture with their frontman a few weeks back, could Blood Incantation be a contender?
Wonder if we'll get a new track before the album release too.
MISÞYRMING are great live and Darkest Era are always solid so yeah will definitely be hitting the gig.
Rose Tattoo!
Quote from: ldj on September 04, 2023, 05:22:12 PMWonder if we'll get a new track before the album release too.
They must have heard me, new track just gone up on Spotify!
Is it good? I don't have Spotify so I'll have to wait till it's up on YouTube.
Musically....ok? Kinda just plods along for the first bit - His voice is fantastic though.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SPLD55C2bAY
He went for it on with that scream!
Some nice guitar parts. It seems to stay in 1 gear so I'd say it has to be heard in the context of the album.
The world seems weird to me since witnessing "Antichrist Siege Machine", making this sound a bit drab!
Actually I like that one more than the other one. Strangely that seems more like an album closer to me. Nice gentle lilt to it and I like that AA spends some time in the lower registers. It's welcome.
Enjoyed that one, for sure.
Much preferred it to the first track, which has grown on me too.
Roll on the album.
Enjoyed it more than the previous track released, even though it didn't really go anywhere. (Looking at the cover art) that album will forever be called Feck Off Crows for me.
Michael Collins was on the telly box there while I was back. Seeing the cover art now for the first time since, along with the title, makes me think of that; a faceless/nameless lad from about a century ago on their way to assassinate someone great/a representative or symbol of a great idea or movement.
Ya, that's another cool tune. Looking forward to the album now.
Went back to the first one there as well and liking it even more.
I love the first one. It immediately clicked for me.
This one needs more time but overall I'm really looking forward to the full thing.
AA is on Into The Necrosphere next Tuesday so I expect lots of beard stroking and complaining. Looking forward to it.
Quote from: Eoin McLove on September 05, 2023, 03:02:23 AMIs it good? I don't have Spotify so I'll have to wait till it's up on YouTube.
You should still be able to listen I have never had a paid spotify account and I can listen to podcasts on it.
It's up on YouTube. I can never get Spotify to play more than 20 second snippets.
Have listened to both a good few times now. Definitely promising. The first one certainly benefits from being listened to without the video! :-X
The second track has vocals which return to the earlier clean style which I like.
Will check out the album for sure. Hoping for something more coherent this time, missing since TTND in my opinion.
The second song clicked for me upon the first listen. I am still not gone on the first song despite listening to it several times since my last post.
I'll find it difficult to justify buying the vinyl of this with the state of the artwork on it but maybe if the rest of the album sounds good I'll bite the bullet. Postage to Oz would give you the willies.
Got a ticket for the Academy gig this morning. I'm probably most looking forward to see Mispyrming. Algleymi is one of my favourite albums of the last ten years.
Mmmm I'm not sure about 2nd song either. Fuck I hope I'm wrong about this.
Been on a big Primordial buzz the last few days since these two new songs came out.
Not saying anything new here but the early to mid period gear is absolutely golden. We were/are very lucky to have them as Irelands flagship metal band.
Listened to most of the albums again in random order (some on Spotify which has re-release versions with bonus live tracks I've never heard- the journeys end one live in Portugal 1999 stood out!)
Some things I noted. AA was a better BM vocalist than I had previously given him credit for. His rasp and odd little individual touches were top notch. Rrragh!
Imrama is great. Bold and individualistic. I should dig it out more.
There is nothing to beat the feeling on tracks like Autumns Ablaze, The Burning Season, Sons of the Morrigan. Stunning.
I wish they had kept up with the Celtic thing. The odd bit of Bodhran, whistle, gaeilge, Yeats, mythology....
It's impossible to pick a favourite album. But anything from AJE through to TGW wins. Imrama and TTND also very good but two different bands by then.
I can't get my head around the post TTND output. I admire them for always moving forward and trying new things. The last few albums are no rehash of TTND as is often suggested. There's loads of weird un-Primordial stuff in there but much of it jars and doesn't flow in an album sense. Where Greater Men Have Fallen is atrocious in this regard. Each track veering from one style to the next. Babels Tower, Come the Flood, Ghosts of the Charnel House, Alchemists Head.... jeezo....
But the moments they already gave us, immortalised on record.... sensational. The Golden Spiral. Is there a better opening track anywhere? "Raised my fist, To the cobalt sky". Shivers down my spine every time I hear that tune.
ticket sorted
A full album of The Alchemist's Head style songs would be a real treat. So dark and interesting.
There is a review up on nocleansinging.
I'm beginning to wish I hadn't read it.
There will be many I'm sure.
Roll on Friday.
He got plenty of mileage out of asking if this is really how it ends. Like, really really! Phenomenal writing.
QuoteThe album does suffer from being slightly inconsistent and certainly has its weak points, but overall it's definitely a solid Primordial album
I wish the review ended after the first sentence. Way to say nothing and offer no definitive stance on the record in any shape or form.
There's a review up on the Metallurgy YouTube channel the last week or so. Its less than glowing.
Angrymetalguy aren't heaping on the praise either.
The All Against All track is getting a kicking from all sides.
Seething tells me I'm going to like that song.
Nothing like a good seethe to get the aul thoughts straight! :laugh:
:o
Quote from: Eoin McLove on September 28, 2023, 12:35:45 AMSeething tells me I'm going to like that song.
Despite telling myself I wouldn't read anymore reviews I did.
Quite a few of have said the album is brilliant and that track in particular is a bold highlight.
I'm looking forward to hearing this song that's causing such controversy within the metal muso beard strokers.
Yeah me too. It'll surely be a surprise if nothing else.
Quote from: Circlepit on September 27, 2023, 04:55:20 PMAngrymetalguy aren't heaping on the praise either.
The All Against All track is getting a kicking from all sides.
"that features a lengthy section where Namtheanga seems to be imitating a didgeridoo with his wordless vocals"
I'm definitely intrigued now.
He did what I could only describe as an attempt at Mongolian throat singing at the end of a song (not a new one, just can't remember which) in Drogheda the other week.
Quote from: Pentagrimes on September 28, 2023, 10:19:48 AMQuote from: Circlepit on September 27, 2023, 04:55:20 PMAngrymetalguy aren't heaping on the praise either.
The All Against All track is getting a kicking from all sides.
"that features a lengthy section where Namtheanga seems to be imitating a didgeridoo with his wordless vocals"
I mean, I suppose you could translate imrama as walkabout..? :laugh:
Quote from: Pentagrimes on September 28, 2023, 10:19:48 AMQuote from: Circlepit on September 27, 2023, 04:55:20 PMAngrymetalguy aren't heaping on the praise either.
The All Against All track is getting a kicking from all sides.
"that features a lengthy section where Namtheanga seems to be imitating a didgeridoo with his wordless vocals"
I'm definitely intrigued now.
In my mind I'm hearing Barney Greenway singing the Smear Campaign title track over Primordial.
Somebody couldn't resist making a Vietnamcore pun in the comment section as the article keeps referring to him as Namtheanga.
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Namtheanga :laugh: that's from growing up on the wrong side of the tracks... in Sutton! :laugh:
The albums out there now for download if you are so inclined (I've ordered it but hasn't came yet.) I finished up work early, got home; made meself a fancy girly Baileys frappe type thing and rolled a couple of joints. Have the house to meself so I have it on blast now. Gonna reflect on my misery and the state of the world now while I take this album in. Been looking forward to this one! 8)
Up on Spotify now. All against all definitely isn't a great song but I think the throat singing is actually the most interesting part?
I presume you're in Oz?
Ah sorry my bad, I'm in NZ and it's friday morning here :-X
I listened to the songs How It Ends and another one whose name is escaping me now (Nothing New Under the Sun). Both fairly dull and boring. Might be just that I'm not in the mood so I'll try the full album later and see but there seems to be a lack of spark and a serious lack of editing going on. Songs seem to drone on with no real direction for 6 minutes and then end.
Call to Cernunnos on there. Started off well with a strong Storm Before Calm vibe. It then ran out of steam after three or four minutes before plodding to death at the six minute mark. I think they could have made that end section really cool if they killed the galloping beat and made it more dark and doomy. The melody would have retained the Celtic feel while bringing in something more stark and interesting to the song. Jaysus, I'm losing hope.
Halfway through Death Holy Death and I had to kill it. Well, I think Namtheanga did that for me. Really cool music in it but the singing is awful. Total butchery.
All Against All is a highlight for me. Cool riffing at the start that puts me in mind of Head of the Alchemist- ie. dark, atonal and a bit more unusual for Primordial. The digeridoo vicals work well but the end of the song kind of goes nowhere. Every song maintains a similar or completely identical tempo throughout. I don't think that was always the case, was it? Maybe it was and it didn't matter because the music was compelling enough for you not to notice.
There's very little so far for me to get really excited about. The shit artwork was a bad omen and much of the songwriting isn't exactly putting a good case forward to make a purchase... the completist in me might yet win out but I think if this was any other band than Primordial I would have written it off already.
Ploughs to Rust isn't bad at all. Great riffs and cool vocal patterns but it ends up going nowhere. I don't know why they don't develop the songs more and add a few twists and turns in along the way.
We Shall Not Serve is among the best on the album I think. The music is so dark and evocative, and reminiscent to me if the Spirit/Storm era. The vocals are ok but an all out BM attack would have suited it much better. Sure look it.
Tradisiúnta is a little beaut. I've said it before but it would be great to see Ciaran and Simon do a folk album together, even with a bit of folk rock like this thrown in. When they want to unleash a bit of magic they still have it in them.
A frustrating listen all in, I think. A few good tracks that could have been made much better with more thought and effort put in to the arrangements. A few real stinkers in there as well.
I ordered it this morning from Sentinel, we'll see.
Yeah first impressions - most reviews talked about how strongly the album starts off - I'd disagree with that, first 2 songs did nothing for me, esp the second. Main issue is quality control and figuring out where the songs end up. Lot of meandering riffs. Some issues around track ordering, Victory should be the first then kick into 'We Shall Not Serve' which is a good song.
'Pilgrimage' isn't as bad now to me stacked up against the rest, but as someone said before, a poor mans Coffin Ships. 'Nothing New Under The Sun' another good one I thought, maybe should have put towards the end of the album. 'Call To Cernunnos' as said above - gets stale real fast after about 2/3 minutes.
'All Against All' - I agree, it's actually a highlight, I like that odd high guitar lick stuff with the straight forward beat/bass line. The song, like others, they don't seem to know how progress some of the songs in an interesting manner. Personally think Alan sounds brilliant on the album, seems to get better as time goes on. But there's some odd vocal line choices, mainly in 'Death Holy Death' - too much wailing. 'Victory' turns out to be probably the best overall song on the album as it feels there was more thought put into that one compared to the rest of the album.
Not sure if this will improve with more listens but shall see. Exile took a while to get into.
I'm just on Pilgrimage and there's nothing that will bring me back to this, I'm afraid.
It was inevitable. They've pretty much given us a flawless catalogue up to Nameless, so owe nobody anything really - but this is the first time I've genuinely felt let down by a new Primordial album.
I think what's disappointed me the most having listened to it twice this morning is the lack of any moments that make the hair on the back of your neck stand, frankly some of it is a chore to get through and more than once found the mind wandering, hoping the next track might be better.
Even on Redemption or Greater I'd at least say to myself that some of the material would sound great at a festival I'm sure but the material on this record is so dull all I can imagine is it bogging down the set.
That's true, they owe us nothing and there is enough great music in their back catalogue to keep me happy till doomsday, but it's a hard cold fact that this album is well below par. Maybe not right down there with Redemption and a little above Where Greater Men Have Fallen. Strange how dull it sounds coming after Exile which felt really vibrant to me, and like a band revitalised. Was that a final fiery attack before ultimate creative death? We'll see. Maybe these songs are slow burners, but initial contact isn't exactly thrilling.
Just starting now. I hope this is not their 72 seasons.
Redemption is a great album.
Redemption is a cunt of a thing. Truly bad. Any argument and I'll set TIR on you.
Had a listen this morning and yeah, I'll give it a few listens to judge properly but so far nothing really sticking out.
Exile was fairly divisive but I remember liking tracks like To Hell or the Hangman and Nail Their Tongues immediately. The only track that really sticks out so far is All Against All, that like To Hell... has a bit of a post-punk/Killing Joke thing going on, maybe that's something they could have explored a bit more.
Quote from: Eoin McLove on September 29, 2023, 11:07:31 AMRedemption is a cunt of a thing. Truly bad. Any argument and I'll set TIR on you.
Set away. Its great.
This new one however. AA has said many times that he records his vocals in one take when possible with no real input from the rest of them.
So far this screams that fact. Whilst he sounds powerful etc the melodies chosen are very AA. Particularly We Shall Not Serve.
I'd imagine he would fight tooth and nail with somebody telling him no/try something different.
It could be a grower. Exile took ages to clock for me.
Finally... Nothing New Under The Sun is brilliant. Sounds like something completely different.
Andy is correct!
Redemption is near impossible to listen to anymore, IMO. And 'Greater Men' got stale fairly quick too, but nowhere near Redemption.
Both those albums actually pute completely off even bothering with 'Exile'. But talk on here about that one has at least peaked my interest to finally give it a go.
I'll listen to the new one, but not buying till I try it.
Alan could definitely do with attempting a few more takes I think, or at least planning his melodies out more because he always ends up falling back on the same few phrasings, not to mention the lyrical Bingo effect mentioned earlier. Martyrs to dust in bitter defeat... Apparently the last few albums have been about different things but how could you even tell, with the exception of Exile which seemed injected with plenty of new ideas. But that creativity seems to have mostly dried up again. Back to the old martyrs.
Quote from: Circlepit on September 29, 2023, 11:28:09 AMQuote from: Eoin McLove on September 29, 2023, 11:07:31 AMRedemption is a cunt of a thing. Truly bad. Any argument and I'll set TIR on you.
Finally... Nothing New Under The Sun is brilliant. Sounds like something completely different.
I thought the exact opposite. Total rehashing of everything they've been at for ages.
I thought it started out well but then the lead melody that came in on top was so predictable it killed any momentum. I'll have to listen to the whole thing through a couple of times and see if it's worth buying but if so it'll be just a CD purchase.
First listen finished.
I'll give a while and go again.
It's a lot to get through.
So far I'd say cut out track 2 and 3 and it's really good. I'll be in the minority but that's fine. The tracks that were getting hammered in reviews are the best ones for me.
I was hoping for a lot more BM screeches but alas.
Damn lads, colorful craic. So far I am loving the new album. I'm not great at describing and/or criticizing (no insult intended to any of you, I honestly appreciate it) music as you guys may be, but I know I don't dislike any of the songs. I really feel I need time with the album to know how I feel about the songs honestly. It's heavy work not easily consumed really.
So far I think I like the song Pilgrimage to the Worlds End the best out of it. I actually really feel the lyrics man, especially the opening lines. Me head is fucking melted with a lot of shit and darkness lately and some things in my life, are coming to a long overdue head, and much like the albums title, to an End.
Dunno how couple heads not feeling the 1st or 2nd tracks man, Simon on the drums, when he kicks in on the 1st/Title song with tasty fills, and very well produced I may add, just fucking cheered me up, he rocks, his style is so original and concise, he blends Metal drums with trad Celtic percussion stuff so tastefully. and the guitar riffing in the 2nd song Ploughs To Rust! How is that not deadly? It sounds like black metal AC/DC or some shit; I like it....
The only bad thing I can think of to say or critic would be that while its awesome and real, I was hoping musically it was going to be a bit more darker and evil, maybe just a bit more BLACK METAL and a little less Celtic or trad, as cool as it is. and Just like Circlepit said there, more of Alan's black metal screeches and howls would've rocked.
But now that I think about it, I guess for that, if you want evil Nemtheanga, we DO have VERMINOUS SERPENT! 8)
I think Tradisiùnta is possibly my favorite song on it after a couple of listens. It's actually emotional sounding music and melodically a bit sad and beautiful. I don't think the songs are terrible as such, just very formulaic and lacking adventure at times. A full album of that instrumental stuff would be a treat.
All Against All is class :abbath: Just rolling to the end of a first listen to the full thing while reading here. It's been great music for that anyway, but All Against All I stopped reading to listen to.
Second and third listens this morning, and with a clearer less-easily-entertained head on me than last night. Still enjoying it though. And All Against All really is a stand out: got a bit of a Serpent Noir meets Bethlehem vibe to it, a bit like a glimpse of what a parallel universe Primordial could have evolved into at a much earlier juncture. The run of the last four songs overall is a great mix of traditional and more adventurous. Nothing New Under The Sun is perhaps the most formulaic... but on the other hand, is that some kind of song-title resonating thematic wink?? Dunno. Anyway, good album :abbath:
Just one listen in earlier today and starting a second now.
First impressions.....
I liked a lot of the melodic guitar work which had that Celtic feel of Spirit/Storm.
There didn't seem to be any big, obvious live festival songs and there was a more plodding, pensive atmosphere across the whole work which I think isn't a bad thing.
Some songs had great potential but didn't seem to peak.
They are still a creative band and there's lots of new and interesting things in there so fair play to them for that.
Vocally it's more of the same. The BM rasp is in the grave. I don't like the vocals at all these days and have made that clear many times! However they did not seem as grating as on Redemption or Greater Men.
I will listen to it a few more times probably but highly unlikely to buy.
...............
I've gone through a bit of 'a metallica' with Primordial. Where I loved the original band and they played a huge part in my musical life but the fall off the cliff left me unable to fully appreciate the good stuff anymore, or separate it from the newer material.
I'm a long time out the other side with Metallica and can love the 80s gear again while totally disregarding anything 'new'. I'm reaching the same stage with Primordial where I am completely separating them into two eras, classic and meh, and not allowing dross like bloodied yet unbowed etc affect my love for the earlier golden age.
I'm kind of surprised by some of the sentiments regarding the recent material. I'm in my 20's so I didn't know Primordial during their 'prime', I understand Redemption... and Where Greater Men... aren't quite as vital maybe but it's not as if they've released St. Anger or Super Collider either. They've just gotten older and they've found their sound, no identity crisises, attempts at jumping on bandwagons, and they didn't do that 'back to the roots' thing of trying to sound like they're 20 again either.
That's not to say the recent stuff is perfect, but it's nothing to be ashamed of either. Just stuck the new one on for another spin now.
It's interesting alright to see how they're perceived maybe a bit more critically by an Irish audience, judging on what I've read over the years on this board and MI before it. It makes some sense though as many indeed have been sticking with them since the early days or at least have given the back catalogue a lot of time, so would naturally just have stronger opinions on their evolution and whether they like it or not. They're probably just held to a slightly higher standard in Ireland, and I see them akin to a band like Voivod -- where even their lesser output is nearly just a result of the high standard they have set in the past, and the progression and evolution is just a matter of differing tastes for some. It's all pretty damn good to be fair.
I discovered the band through TGW on the year it came out and quickly bought Spirit The Earth Aflame after, alongside borrowing a mate's copy of Storm Before Calm. Those three are still probably my favourites, and I loved the evolution in sound on TTND. Since then, I pick certain tracks from 'Redemption' and 'Where Greater Men' to listen to but not too often. 'Exile' was a brilliant return to form.
This one,albeit after only listen... disappointing! All Against All is so far above par compared to the rest that it sounds like it was written in a different (and far more creative) period of the band's career entirely. Will give it more time, but likely not a lot.
A few posters now saying its a big step down in quality from Exile, so at least when I do eventually listen to the new album I won't have any great expectations.
I've listened to it quite a bit and the docile CD arrive this morning.
The medium shirt is quite short and I'm not tall!
I have to say I really like it more and more with each listen. The only tracks that aren't clicking for me are tracks 2 and 3.
Some random thoughts after a first listen :
Pilgrimage to the World's End reminds me a lot of the song Exile Amongst the Ruins, in a good way.
Ploughs to Dust sounds like a poor man's Rome Burns.
The instrumental is great.
It's folly to judge a Primordial album until at least 3 listens in, I've a feeling I will like this one plenty but it needs to lose a song or two.
I feel the guitar riffs are struggling a bit to be memorable these days - heavy on atmosphere but we're a long ways now from something like Glorious Dawn or even Lain with the Wolf. Alan has to pick the slack up in terms of giving the songs something memorable.
One proper full listen today and I'm quite liking it. It doesn't reach the hair-raising highs of other albums, but at least they're still trying to shoot for them.
This thread has worked a treat for lowering the expectations so I came away from my first listen there with more of a 'it's really not all that bad' than a 'holy shit ,the boys have dropped the ball here'..There's no doubt some parts don't work and it's suffering from a bit of bloat...and it's somewhat disjointed as an overall experience..but yeah, it's really not all that bad at all! Alan's singing is top notch and undoubtedly the outstanding component. usual lyrical tropes aside.
Yeah! His vocals are on of the highlights. And as usual, so are SOL's drums.
I'm getting a lot of hints at almost every other album from the guitars, too. I think that's where the 'disjointed' vibe is coming from.
I keep seeing reviewers and punters commenting about it being a black metal album.
It's far from it. They haven't been a black metal band for 20+ years at this stage.
Celtic, Pagan, Epic Metal... Yes! But certainly not Black anymore.
Yep, I found all the mention of black metal more than a little strange.
Quote from: jobrok1 on October 03, 2023, 08:36:28 AMI keep seeing reviewers and punters commenting about it being a black metal album.
It's far from it. They haven't been a black metal band for 20+ years at this stage.
Celtic, Pagan, Epic Metal... Yes! But certainly not Black anymore.
Yeah it's very odd at this stage!
Few more listens in - All Against All is very much the standout track for me - As Chris said it's very much like Bethlehem, spot on! As cliche as it would be, I think the title track should have ended the album with Victory being the first song. Ploughs still doesn't do anything for me, I think it's mainly that riff that kicks in at 1:16 that annoys the f**k out of me! It's reminds me of Iron Maidens 'A Matter of Life and Death' in terms of bloat and meandering intros/outros even though there is some solid songs in there.
I actually think that apart from Tradisiúnta, We Shall Not Serve is the best song on it. Musically anyway. It should have had proper snarling black metal vocals over it rather than the almost zero melody singing. I say almost zero, the bit of melody there is has been swiped from In Solitude! I honestly can't help but think that Alan phoned this one in.
Edit. And the main vocal melody in How It Ends is from a Procession song... lads lads lads.
The intro riff is brilliant on We Shall Not Serve, on first listen I thought it was heading back to a real old style song but it wasn't to be.
What's the Procession song?
Not sure. Maybe something from the demo but definitely sounds like them.
Ploughs to Rust is a great song actually. I like it a lot.
I must give the bonus disc a go to see,
The old demos should be savage.
QuoteAs cliche as it would be, I think the title track should have ended the album with Victory being the first song.
Maybe clichéd but I'd agree. The run of album openers from TTND up to WGMHF were all very much of that anthemic, immediate style they've been doing for years now and it works well to kick off an album. Nail Their Tongues from the last one really deviated from that in a great way and set the stage for what was a darker, more melancholic album overall (bar the 2nd track and the ballad).
The opener on this new one seems to go for that 'immediate banger' buzz but falls short. Victory would have fitted better imo too. Anyway, fuck it I'm probably talking out of my hole having not given it enough time yet. Here goes...
Bar Spirit the Earth Aflame, and the sheer emotion of The Coffin Ships (which is robbed of so much power because of Anderson's shite production job), these boys are the most overrated band to ever come out of Ireland; seven to eight minute songs that are largely directionless and copy+paste riffs that are so unmemorable. Yep, this is no different.
Had a good laugh at the opening riff to Victory has 1,000 Fathers - it sounds like some lad at a trad session trying to play a Van Halen lick.
Well hey, at least you're in a club of at least two, with none other than AA Nemty himself, in thinking that the production on TGW is a weak spot!
Going to delve in again at work tonight but the bar just got higher having been slain by the new Marduk a few times today..
Still listening. Think How It Ends works perfectly as an opener. Wouldn't say they were going for an 'immediate banger'; the almost two minute instrumental build before even the drums come in makes for a much better mood setter than the Lizzy/Horslips style opening riff of Victory...
Think I'm gonna be ordering it.
Yeah, I got the impression they,or Alan, thought it would be too obvious to have the title track as a closer so they turned it on it's head. Works fine.
Imrama on in the car. What a superb album. I am 99% sure that in 94 or 95 when it came out all of its idiosyncrasies would have flown over my tender machinefuckinhead, but I love its naive charm, its hunger, its passionate, creative kitchen sink approach, its energy... and it has possibly my favorite of all of their album covers, although the demo, Spirit and Gathering all work perfectly in their own different ways too. Even the early logo is cool. I have to pick this one up on vinyl soon, and hopefully not the bubblegum pink version I've seen. A long sleeve with that artwork would be welcome as well but no doubt such a thing is for the realm of daydreams.
Struggling to get into the album. Only given it a few listens while working but after the first 4 minutes of the title track, the rest is completely lost to me.
Have given this a few spins while working and there is some old stuff definately in there.Gathering Wilderness and Journeys end inspired riffs in parts.
Gets a bit better with each listen so will give it time but not as good as Exiles.
Finally sat down with this unwieldy beast last night. First impressions, really liked the opener title track.
Some really strong songs at first listen, definitely a bit of filler, liked the will not serve song and Tradisiunta. Better than expected.
Have it on again this morning. I think all said and done, the material is simply just dull. There's little if nothing to get the blood pumping and a lot of the tracks just meander aimlessly. Death Holy Death for example I find really hard to get through.
QuoteWe Shall Not Serve is the best song on it
Surprised to read that, I find that one tough too - the lyrics are cringey and musically there's nothing there that they haven't done much more effectively in the past.
Think my own favourite is Pilgrimage to the Worlds End, really dig the vibe of that one and it's one of the few tracks that conjures any kind of real atmosphere. Given the theme and pace of the track it really delivers on the feeling of impending doom. Alan's high pitch vocal in the middle really is something else.
Pains me to say some of the above, in terms of the negative aspects . I'll probably stick with it for another small bit but will leave it then. I'll be hitting the gig next year, maybe it'll make better sense live? Wishful thinking?
Just to add about the artwork, I got the CD version. The landscape on the foldout of the digi or a partial of it would've been much better.
It's the second half, or Side B, that I seem to be losing my way with, it's like they're just jamming out stuff at times, kinda like the last Maiden in that regard, though still a lot more interesting than the second half of that was!
Still dipping in to a song here and there every other day but it is not growing on me. In fact, if anything it is getting more disappointing with repeated listens. I think I'll skip this one in the hope that they will come back strong on the next one.
I've had enough of Primordial playing it safe, they are better than this. Time for Alan to discover new subject matter and maybe stop fooling himself that he is a singer. His singing is great in small doses but the snarl is his forté.
After leaving it for a few days I went back to it this morning.
I still like it but songs 2 and 3 just don't cut it. Especially the third track. When the intro starts I feel like it's getting ready for a ripper but no.
That track on particular has a meandering half baked vocal line.
From the instrumental on I'm hooked. I wish there was more backing vocals with harmonies. They really lift it especially in Nothing New....
Overall it's sounds like they may have been unsure exactly where they were going with the whole thing.
Bit disappointed with this..... or with myself for being over it! :laugh:
Its no Journey's End. I loved "....Redemption at the puritans hand", I think there is nothing like "Exile amongst ruins" songs such as "Stolen years" or "to hell or the hangman", they suck you in and keep you there. Maybe you live it!
New album has its moments, a bit long? once or twice its a bit directionless. Maybe that is best captured in the video if you get me.
The second disc did nothing for me....
Maybe I'll pick it up again.
I had been looking forward to this for ages, but after a fair few listens, it just wasn't really worth the wait.
So very safe, as was said above.
No one expected them to take risks ,did they ?
Safe metal for mutton head festival fodder
Ah it's better than that, I'd say 3 stars.
My background working/reading music all weekend has been Primordial, revisiting at least twice each all the albums since and including To The Nameless Dead. I don't own any of these albums, so some of them I haven't listened to in full since their initial release.
Redemption... came across the weakest, Where Greater Men Have Fallen the strong surprise, maybe as good as TTND..? Exile... has its ups and downs, as does How It Ends, though I do think it's stronger and more interesting than either Exile or Redemption, and here I am happily listening to it again today.
Redemption is definitely their weakest effort I think.
WGMHF, as I've pointed out here a few times, is actually pretty decent. Half of it is fantastic. The other half is kind of meh though.
Exile didn't quite have the peaks of WGMHF but was a more consistent album and probably their best since TTND. I've listened to the new one once (most of it) but need to give it a proper go. I liked the folk/instrumental track.
Here I go again banding the drum.
Redemption is brilliant.
Ah sure, couple of things to do here, I'll give Redemption another shot. Maybe listening straight after a first go of TTND in years cast it in a bad light.
Quote from: Black Shepherd Carnage on October 16, 2023, 09:44:29 PMAh sure, couple of things to do here, I'll give Redemption another shot. Maybe listening straight after a first go of TTND in years cast it in a bad light.
No Grave is a belter. Lain with the Wolf starts off well, but gets fairly tedious in places. Bloodied Yet Unbowed is a chore. Bow, please bow. God's Old Snake, quality tune, some unusual stuff in here. The Mouth of Judas, AA going for a Frank from MB in the intro. Closer to TGW territory, decent tune. Primordial's Blaze of Glory. They should definitely cover that. Shot down in a blaze of gallows. This song has now gotten too long. Two minutes to go. Christ, shut your mouth Judas. The Black Hundred, good intro. Ah, speak of the devil: there's the gallows there now! This tune is grand, sounds almost like a work in progress in places though. Poor ending. The Puritan's Hand is decent, fairly TGW style too. Death of Gods decent too. So yeah, it definitely has its moments, but tracks that become a chore really bog any album listening experience down. But hey, one man's chore is another man's spoonful of sugar! :abbath:
That was some stream of consciousness review right there Shep. Bow, please bow (already) 😄
So it's getting to that time of year and I've gone back to this thinking is this really going to be the first time the band released something that doesn't make my twenty favourites of the year. After the first three songs , the first two in particular , it's all good ,I'm definitely going to have this in there, what was I thinking?
But then there's that whole middle section to the album which just lulls along interminably so much so that Pilgrimage To The World's End has now become Pilgrimage To The End Of The Album in my head . Last song is decent but by then the damage has been done and I really have to rule this out of contention now for any end of year gongs. Genuinely sad to say that too.
The surprise special guest was just announced for the show in April as Hellripper. Pretty underwhelming was expecting something a lot better the way it was kept secret for so long.
Probably holding off until they had played there Limerick gig
Pretty happy with that announcement myself
New album is a grower
Quote from: mickO))) on January 10, 2024, 11:23:53 AMThe surprise special guest was just announced for the show in April as Hellripper. Pretty underwhelming was expecting something a lot better the way it was kept secret for so long.
Thought the same tbh, I wondered if it was supposed to be someone else and it fell through. Fine band, of course, but I thought it was going to be something much grander.
I seen Misanthropy mentioned here somewhre.
I still have my Primordial, "A journeys end" Misanthropy shirt....... that was a mad time, wasn't there an argy bargy with the Cradle of Filth guys
Quote from: mickO))) on January 10, 2024, 11:23:53 AMThe surprise special guest was just announced for the show in April as Hellripper. Pretty underwhelming was expecting something a lot better the way it was kept secret for so long.
I went to see Hellripper live before new years they put on a pretty awesome show and their drummer is very good live fun to see. they're also touring with Abbath at the moment I think :D
:abbath:
Saw them supporting Morbid Angel at the TBMC and thought they were abysmal, but then saw them years later at Hellfest and thought they were incredible.
Still genuinely really enjoying How It Ends, listened to it several times a week since release. But why can't I shake off the feeling that part of the reason I like it so much is that I'm getting old? :laugh:
I still haven't caved and bought it. If I saw it in the shop the completist in me might win out but ordering it online seems unlikely to me at this stage.
Yes I go back to it now and then, title track is great and 2 or 3 other outstanding songs
Has anyone picked up the recent Sentinel picture disc of Imrama? I know it comes with the album cover but does it also include a lyric sheet?
No sheet
Bah. Might have to grab the other, non pic version which I assume has a sheet... I'm tempted by A Journey's End as well with the artwork of the trees. I have the old one with the drawing of the head but I prefer the other version.
Video for Death Holy Death:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=odAWinWlkds
Jesus. The worst song on the album and possibly their worst one all in.
It does have b-side written all over it - song could work by cutting out 2 minutes of the meandering (in both vocal melodies and an extra verse/chorus not needed) but I like the video, fits the song well.
Not bad old riffing, but Lord those vocals are terrible. How did one of the lads not step in and say to maybe try something else. It is the epitome of tuneless wailing. Video is grand but sure... just some film.
Ah come on lads stop messing the riff is crap. Like something that never got beyond an initial jam/idea.
It's not my favourite Primordial album in general but there's far better material on the record, that track is the low point and I now skip it every time.
Didn't have any problems with it musically as an album track, don't have any problems with it as a standalone. It's not like "singles" really exist anymore, so I guess Nemty put it forward for a video mainly because his inspiration for the lyrics was apparently highly visual:
Quote"Death holy death is a song about martyrdom, sacrifice and giving your life to a higher ideal, I found myself standing watching a religious procession in a small Italian walled medieval city, a movement which had not changed much in 500 years, the city walls draped in the same flags, the same saints, martyrs, knights, queens, kings and demons, weathered and decayed but still standing on the walls and ramparts. The local saint flayed alive in the town square for Heresy and remembered for her devotion half a millenia later. Sacrifice endures. The passion of Joan of Arc (1928) seemed to perfectly fit to the song....." - A.A. Nemtheanga
Surprisingly doesn't seem to be much chat about the gig tonight, anyone heading? Early enough stage times across the board, must be a nightclub or some shite on after.
Yeah, I searched through for a thread this morning and couldn't find one. I'm not going to go now since no one else here is bothered.
Will be there with bells on ;). I'll not get there til halfway through Hellripper but not sweating that, looking forward to some Icelandic deviltry after .
Yeah I'm heading in, never seen them live before. Heading to fibbers first for 5 then in to see hellripper
How was the gig, good set?
Hellripper just as much fun as I'd hoped, the band of the night for me. Misþyrming also excellent. Darkest Era....ok but not one older song? Get out ta fuck.
Primordial were fine, bit disappointed in the set list though, only 3 from the new record? Get the impression they are in the victory lap stage now.
Was Shauny from Last Light on bass?
Yeah it wasn't Paul anyway, so I guess so.
Quote from: Circlepit on April 28, 2024, 01:42:13 PMWas Shauny from Last Light on bass?
Yeah. Alan mentioned at some point during the show that Shaun was helping them out for the gig since Paul was unable to play
I'm sure he held it down anyway.
I loved Primordial, great setlist, new songs How it ends, Victory has 1000 fathers, We will not serve all stood up. Also played to enter pagan, Journeys end, the mouth of Judas which were all great.
Enjoyed Mysprming and Hellripper ya good night.
My favourite period,they went on a serious run around then!
That was where I jumped on board. It remains their apogee, despite having released some serious stuff since. I haven't listened to TTND in years... maybe a decade by now! I'm going to stick it in the car for tomorrow 8)
That makes the first album of today's listening and easy choice!
Such a great run of albums since then. I was underwhelmed by How It Ends, but their other releases range from very good to classic.
Haven't listened to it in years, but I listened to it so much back in the day I probably spoiled it for myself.
This and TTND are probably my favourites from them.
The Cruel Sea is one of my favourite pieces of theirs. It never fails to summon up images of despair and loss.
Their full set from Rockhard festival is up on YouTube. The new tracks sound great live. Trying to get a singalong for As Rome Burns didn't work out that well. It was the first song in the set so that didn't help.
AA seems to love his didgeridoo vocals now.
The Coffin Ships was brilliant.
I thought the same in Dublin, he was always looking for the crowd interaction before maybe earning it.. and then looking a bit miffed because it wasn't completely there. Difficult early doors to get that going.
Quote from: Circlepit on May 22, 2024, 05:07:19 PMThe Cruel Sea is one of my favourite pieces of theirs. It never fails to summon up images of despair and loss.
The Cruel Sea is based on an Irish Trad piece. Wish I could recall the name of it.
Edit: found it. https://youtu.be/RQgXY07sz8Q?si=yk-26m5Gu-Qanuui
Quote from: Isildur on May 27, 2024, 07:38:37 AMQuote from: Circlepit on May 22, 2024, 05:07:19 PMThe Cruel Sea is one of my favourite pieces of theirs. It never fails to summon up images of despair and loss.
The Cruel Sea is based on an Irish Trad piece. Wish I could recall the name of it.
Edit: found it. https://youtu.be/RQgXY07sz8Q?si=yk-26m5Gu-Qanuui
Hadn't heard that. Thank you.
Journey's End > STEA
But both great albums. Hard to think of a band who had a better output in the late 90s and into the 00s.
Nemty's 20 year retrospective on TGW:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdlsxmHkNXk
Fuck me, 20 years.
Great vid. There are few albums or artists who would probably be worth hearing about in this manner, which is a shame. Knowing every beat and nuance of it definitely helps, too.
I think the closing message of time being crucial to how an album hits is very true. It was later in 2005 when I got it, reminds me of getting into more and more BM, this being part of that world, but also totally separate, it being my intro to the band, learning that bands this good came from Ireland, etc. I was studying for my LC and was just pouring over music as much as I could get. Lyrically it felt like I was mainlining The Truth About Things.
Jan06, Exhumed (I think ?!) cancelled a gig shirt notice and Primordial stepped in and it was my first of countless shows since. Class time, unreal album.
Ya, that Exhumed gig was my first as well and the timing couldn't have been better as, while I had and enjoyed Spirit, this one burst the whole thing open for me. Still my 2 favourites without question. May listen to that pod but have discussed his dislike for the album many times.
Enjoyed that, what an album and time that was in the Irish scene. Thing is, it's become one of those album that you, well me anyway, played so much, knew so well, that nowadays I'd safely say I'd be grabbing any of the other ones to play before it. Part of that too is that TGW also evokes a sadness that era is gone, a nostalgia for that time and just a general longing to be out there on the gigging scene again which I'm not anymore. Kinda like listening to a WASP album which makes you want to go to the nearest rock bar and raise all hell yet you know there is no rock bars, near or far, and that anything over five or six pints will leave you crippled for a week now anyway.
Ah, a glass of red and The Gathering Wilderness by the fireside is probably the way to go then.
Would you ever want them back?
From time to time, yeah.
"The Coffin Ships" is fucking unreal, but I just cannot get my ears around Anderson's utterly shite mix.
I still blame John Kenny for mixing up Primordial and Waylander on the metal show for one night for putting me off them for years until I heard The Coffin Ships on a Terrorizer(or was it Metal Hammer?) CD.
I didn't know that Anderson bailed out before finishing the job or that there are all sorts of wrong bits in there like guitar tones changing from song to song and even within songs themselves. I think it's fine as it is though, and there's a good argument for all of those sorts of unexpected accidents and mistakes being integral to the story of an album. It wears its history within the production.
I fired it on here now, naturally.
Ah lads 'A Journeys End' puts me right in a place and time!
Yes indeed, I'll get my jacket and lets go if only turning that album on took me back in some deranged DeLorean moment.
Imrama didn't catch me, Collie and Joey were still in school in Skerries and Ciaran had given them cd's......
What a time!
Quote from: Sworntothecans on March 01, 2025, 01:29:26 AMI still blame John Kenny for mixing up Primordial and Waylander on the metal show for one night for putting me off them for years until I heard The Coffin Ships on a Terrorizer(or was it Metal Hammer?) CD.
Ah, so he mixed them up twice the plonkwr!! :laugh:
The first time he mixed them up with Sepultura for advance tracks off the new album back then. :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Imrama also didn't grab me. It has always been Storm and Spirit as the pinnacle for me. :abbath:
Yes this is a great record apart from the production.